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Thread: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

  1. #351
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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    I reckon not.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Red herring. Illegality is not the subject.
    Okay, so they did nothing illegal. In your mind, what has Koch done wrong with their Koch Industries? Please be specific as you can. Thanks.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Who said they did anything wrong? They inherited a company, made a sh*t load of money, and now they're using it to buy political influence and shape public policy to help them make even more money.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by LesGovt View Post
    Silly side show? You think saving the country from economic disaster is silly? Wow!
    The debt ceiling crisis was manufactured by the GOP when they threatened to hold the economy hostage for their ideology. You didn't know that? Wow!
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You got a link for that? A real link, not Leftist nut-job conspiracy trufer/warmer website.
    The Billionaire Koch Brothers’ War Against Obama : The New Yorker

    their companies have benefitted from nearly a hundred million dollars in government contracts since 2000.
    The Koch brothers are involved in the energy industry which is heavily subsidized by the govt. The same goes for the lumber and paper industries, which they are involved in. Their father made his money doing business with Stalin

    7 Ways the Koch Bros. Benefit from Corporate Welfare | The New York Observer

    Pickens: It

    Even the Kochs admit that they take govt subsidies
    Pickens went on to criticize Koch for accepting subsides for ethanol production. Koch Industries, as a refiner of oil, blends ethanol with gasoline it produces in order to meet federal mandates on ethanol usage. Even though Koch opposes subsidies for ethanol, Koch accepts the subsidies. A company newsletter explains: “Once a law is enacted, we are not going to place our company and our employees at a competitive disadvantage by not participating in programs that are available to our competitors.”
    Koch makes money off the govt
    http://www.fossil.energy.gov/news/te...2002_koch.html
    Last edited by sangha; 08-02-11 at 02:13 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  6. #356
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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I have no need to prove anything to you with your irrelevant and absurd questions. If you can't refute what I said, your nonsense questions are going to get you anywhere. Neither is pointing out a type
    You are the person who said the following: "And the Kock bros. depended on inheritance and govt largesse to make their money. Again, not an example of adding value. More like stealing from the people." If Charles Koch added 40,000 employees and $50 billion in revenue, then he added value. If they received subsidies, how much and when? Were these "subsidies" the same that any other company or any other company who was in the energy field?

    Are my questions silly? Really! Maybe, it would be best for you to prove your point. And, if you are going to make allegations against Koch, I think you should offer proof of what you are saying. Have you done that? If so, I would like to read it.

    Since 1960, the value of the Standard & Poor's 500 grew 80-fold, assuming the reinvestment of dividends. During that same period, the value of Koch Industries grew more than 2,700-fold, using the same assumptions. The growth of Koch companies has been achieved both through acquisitions and through expansion and broadening of existing businesses.

    Koch Industries, Inc

    Wow! Charles took over in 1967. My guess he is greatly responsible for the growth. He has added much value to his company, to the arts, to hospitals, to his country, and to the city of Wichita, KS. Maybe, while you are at their website, you might want to read about the philanthropic work they do.

    Under Charles Koch, Koch Industries now employs about 70,000 people and has $100 billion dollars in revenue and in 2006, under the leadership of Charles, they became the largest private company in the United States, per Forbes Magazine. I think that is quite an accomplishment.

    I look forward to your evidence that my thinking is in error.

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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    The Billionaire Koch Brothers’ War Against Obama : The New Yorker

    The Koch brothers are involved in the energy industry which is heavily subsidized by the govt. The same goes for the lumber and paper industries, which they are involved in. Their father made his money doing business with Stalin

    7 Ways the Koch Bros. Benefit from Corporate Welfare | The New York Observer

    Pickens: It

    Even the Kochs admit that they take govt subsidies

    Koch makes money off the govt
    DOE - Fossil Energy Techline: Koch Submits Winning Bid To Supply Additional Oil to Strategic Reserve
    Assuming some of this is true and not hyped, what's your point? Koch has done nothing wrong, immoral, illegal, etc. You're throwing out the red-herring. If you do not like his company receiving subsidies [which may actually be expense deductions], I suggest that you go to Washington, DC, and tell them to stop it. Government is the problem here, no Koch.

  8. #358
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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by LesGovt View Post
    Okay, so they did nothing illegal. In your mind, what has Koch done wrong with their Koch Industries? Please be specific as you can. Thanks.
    Actually, they have acted illegally. I just pointed out that wasn't the issue I was talking about. My point is that they are the recipients of govt welfare

    DOE - Fossil Energy Techline: Koch Submits Winning Bid To Supply Additional Oil to Strategic Reserve

    Permafrost Friday: The Kochtopus in Alaska | AndrewHalcro.com
    The Koch's own a few refineries in the United States including the Flint Hills Refinery in Fairbanks. In 2003, they paid $265 million in purchasing the refinery from the Williams Companies.

    Less than three years later, Flint Hills began asking for relief from the Murkowski administration. In Februrary of 2006, Flint Hills sent a letter to the state asking for a change to their oil supply contract with the state so that payments owed wouldn't be required.
    USAspending.gov
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  9. #359
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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by AdamT View Post
    Who said they did anything wrong? They inherited a company, made a sh*t load of money, and now they're using it to buy political influence and shape public policy to help them make even more money.
    And they accept billions in govt handouts
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  10. #360
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    Re: Poll: Debt ceiling deal should include cuts and tax increases

    Quote Originally Posted by LesGovt View Post
    You are the person who said the following: "And the Kock bros. depended on inheritance and govt largesse to make their money. Again, not an example of adding value. More like stealing from the people." If Charles Koch added 40,000 employees and $50 billion in revenue, then he added value. If they received subsidies, how much and when? Were these "subsidies" the same that any other company or any other company who was in the energy field?
    No, the govt with its' subsidies added the value.


    Wow! Charles took over in 1967. My guess he is greatly responsible for the growth. He has added much value to his company, to the arts, to hospitals, to his country, and to the city of Wichita, KS. Maybe, while you are at their website, you might want to read about the philanthropic work they do.

    Under Charles Koch, Koch Industries now employs about 70,000 people and has $100 billion dollars in revenue and in 2006, under the leadership of Charles, they became the largest private company in the United States, per Forbes Magazine. I think that is quite an accomplishment.
    He did with govt handouts. He's a welfare queen
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

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