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Thread: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    Those in a make believe think that Bush's tax cuts and the war in Iraq haven't caused the debt problems we have today. Look at the spending for the Defense Dept. in 2001, then look what it is today. Yet, those make believers want everyone to believe the problem is what they call entitlements.
    amazing how you don't actually respond to what's written, but think that you have posted a point. we aren't saying it's wrong of him to cut Defense. we are saying it's wrong of him to want to claim credit for cutting spending we were never going to engage in.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    President Obama has offered $3 and has asked the GOP for $1. The GOP wants it all, to them it's their way or the highway.
    Nope, Pete, hes offering 10% of $3. Thats what you are offering when you are talking about phased cuts over 10 years. Meanwhile hes asking for the $1 to spend right now.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    Those in a make believe think that Bush's tax cuts and the war in Iraq haven't caused the debt problems we have today. Look at the spending for the Defense Dept. in 2001, then look what it is today. Yet, those make believers want everyone to believe the problem is what they call entitlements.
    That's not what he's saying. Let me give an analogy....

    You're talking about the budget right now in the summer with your family. Your finances are hard pressed. You're trying to find ways to save money but at the same time you want to still go out drinking with the guys. So you go to your wife and tell her "Hun, i figured out how to save enough money to let me still go out and drink with my guys. You know that pool we have going with the filter running at all times that runs up our electric bill. Well, I'll save us money by turning it off come the fall and winter. That way we won't be paying for the electricity. We'll save so much money on our bills doing that I'll be able to still go drinking with the guys!"

    In that scenario, you're trying to take something that is already logically going to occur (You're not likely to be running the pool filter all thoruhg fall and winter) and attempting to suggest that said action would be a new way of "saving money" when in reality its money that would not have been spent anyways.

    What cpwill is trying to say is that saying we'll save X amount of dollars by ending the Surge in Afghanistan is a rather hollow number of add to the "savings" because, unless every President for the next 10+ years was going to keep the surge levels going in Afghanistan, that "savings" was inevitable anyways because it'd eventually end.

    If the drawing down of the surge is honeslty one of the ways he's suggesting a "Spending cut" then all Obama is doing is claiming credit for turning the pool filter off in the winter.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    When reading polls you have to consider the source. Lib media takes polls with leading questions,skewed sampling and the power of the press to mold opinions of general public. In short polling has become a tool to shape public opinion not sample it.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Hostage? He offered something Democrats don't offer - cuts to Medicare and other social programs. It's time for the Republicans to compromise.
    Am hearing this claim a lot. Can you cite (or point to) some details of exactly what Obama has proposed in the way of cuts to "Medicare and other social programs"?


    “Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.”

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by Cole View Post
    Am hearing this claim a lot. Can you cite (or point to) some details of exactly what Obama has proposed in the way of cuts to "Medicare and other social programs"?
    In debt talks, Obama offers Social Security cuts - The Washington Post

    A lot of Democrats are pretty pissed about it. He's offered cuts to social security, medicaid and medicare in exchange for ending tax breaks on the wealthy, but I'm not sure which parts specifically.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    From what I understand, his main reform to Medicare in exchange for "tax hikes to the wealthy" is to means test medicare so that the wealthy get less.

    From what I understand, his main reform to Social Security in exchange for "Tax hikes to teh weawlthy" is to raise the upper limit on SS withholdings so that the wealthy pay more.

    So his "reform" he is offering as a "compromise" to get tax cuts on the wealthy are actions which negatively impact the wealthy.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    In debt talks, Obama offers Social Security cuts - The Washington Post

    A lot of Democrats are pretty pissed about it. He's offered cuts to social security, medicaid and medicare in exchange for ending tax breaks on the wealthy, but I'm not sure which parts specifically.
    no, he didn't. he had aides leak hints and suggestions and float balloons. The President (as far as I am aware at least) has never made a specific proposal to reform Social Security so as to reduce expenditures.

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    That's not what he's saying. Let me give an analogy....

    You're talking about the budget right now in the summer with your family. Your finances are hard pressed. You're trying to find ways to save money but at the same time you want to still go out drinking with the guys. So you go to your wife and tell her "Hun, i figured out how to save enough money to let me still go out and drink with my guys. You know that pool we have going with the filter running at all times that runs up our electric bill. Well, I'll save us money by turning it off come the fall and winter. That way we won't be paying for the electricity. We'll save so much money on our bills doing that I'll be able to still go drinking with the guys!"

    In that scenario, you're trying to take something that is already logically going to occur (You're not likely to be running the pool filter all thoruhg fall and winter) and attempting to suggest that said action would be a new way of "saving money" when in reality its money that would not have been spent anyways.

    What cpwill is trying to say is that saying we'll save X amount of dollars by ending the Surge in Afghanistan is a rather hollow number of add to the "savings" because, unless every President for the next 10+ years was going to keep the surge levels going in Afghanistan, that "savings" was inevitable anyways because it'd eventually end.

    If the drawing down of the surge is honeslty one of the ways he's suggesting a "Spending cut" then all Obama is doing is claiming credit for turning the pool filter off in the winter.
    it occurs to me though; by this logic, Republicans have already agreed to major tax increases - as they have not insisted on going to the Ryan Plan rates, we can give them credit for "raising" taxes to the current rates.


    so, Republicans have given the President his tax hikes, he has given Republicans their spending cuts, and all is well! right?


    oh wait. no. dangit, i forgot. the country still get's F*****D

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    Re: Poll: 71% shun GOP handling of debt crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    no, he didn't. he had aides leak hints and suggestions and float balloons. The President (as far as I am aware at least) has never made a specific proposal to reform Social Security so as to reduce expenditures.
    And if there isn't a denial by Dems and Reps, then I'm going to go ahead and say it's true. This is exactly how information of every negotiation first gets out to the public.

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