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Thread: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

  1. #31
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by BDBoop View Post
    Those are really the only corporate choices? Screw the workers, or screw management?
    In the very narrow picture you guys are painting, sometimes yes.

    Employment is optional for both management and wage earner.
    You piss too much on someones cheerios and they resign their positions.
    The company will lose profitability to support any wages and taxes.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    When has America become like Mexico?
    Why should businesses break compensation agreements with the CEO, when it could cost the company more in losses, than if they honored what they agreed to pay?
    I didn't realize you do not know the definition of premise. Here you go: "A proposition upon which an argument is based or from which a conclusion is drawn."
    premise - definition of premise by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

    Upsideguy's premise was,
    "many companies have been cutting workers, making the remaining workers work hard for flat to inflation adjusted decreasing wages... and paying the additional profits out in the form of executive bonuses..... "
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  3. #33
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I didn't realize you do not know the definition of premise. Here you go: "A proposition upon which an argument is based or from which a conclusion is drawn."
    premise - definition of premise by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

    Upsideguy's premise was,
    "many companies have been cutting workers, making the remaining workers work hard for flat to inflation adjusted decreasing wages... and paying the additional profits out in the form of executive bonuses..... "
    "We are creating a Mexican economy in the US."

    Prove this, this is what he said.

    Prove that those businesses didn't cut unnecessary workers and they paid non contractual bonuses.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  4. #34
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    I think if I'm posting record profits, maybe out of some sort of loyalty or compassion for my employees who are making me rich I'd not lay them off. If it ain't broke, and whatnot.

    Yes, I can improve quarterly profit reports by 3% if I lay them off and outsource, but maybe I'm just the sort of person who doesn't see my employees as numbers but rather as people with families.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

  5. #35
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    "We are creating a Mexican economy in the US."

    Prove this, this is what he said.
    That was the associated result of upsideguy's premise which I listed above. Glad we got that cleared up.

    If your really are not aware that CEO's income has been going up dramatically while wage earners have stagnated, I'll provide the documentation. The 2010 Census showed us that as of 2009, 1 in 7 Americans were officially poor. We are creating a Mexican economy, a country of haves and have-nots, just like upsideguy stated.

    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  6. #36
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    When has America become like Mexico?
    Why should businesses break compensation agreements with the CEO, when it could cost the company more in losses, than if they honored what they agreed to pay?
    Exactly when this happened is probably found in another study..... but it has happened.

    Excerpted from Power in American, Wealth, Income and Power. G. William Domhoff

    Who Rules America: Wealth, Income, and Power

    Income inequality in other countries

    The degree of income inequality in the United States can be compared to that in other countries on the basis of the Gini coefficient, a mathematical ratio that allows economists to put all countries on a scale with values that range (hypothetically) from zero (everyone in the country has the same income) to 100 (one person in the country has all the income). On this widely used measure, the United States ends up 95th out of the 134 countries that have been studied -- that is, only 39 of the 134 countries have worse income inequality. The U.S. has a Gini index of 45.0; Sweden is the lowest with 23.0, and South Africa is near the top with 65.0.

    The table that follows displays the scores for 22 major countries, along with their ranking in the longer list of 134 countries that were studied (most of the other countries are very small and/or very poor). In examining this table, remember that it does not measure the same thing as Table 4 earlier in this document, which was about the wealth distribution. Here we are looking at the income distribution, so the two tables won't match up as far as rankings. That's because a country can have a highly concentrated wealth distribution and still have a more equal distribution of income due to high taxes on top income earners and/or high minimum wages -- both Switzerland and Sweden follow this pattern. So one thing that's distinctive about the U.S. compared to other industrialized democracies is that both its wealth and income distributions are highly concentrated.

    and, of course, the result... Third world countries have little to no middle class, which is where the US is headed.



    Table 7: Income equality in selected countries
    Country/Overall Rank Gini Coefficient

    1. Sweden 23.0
    2. Norway 25.0
    8. Austria 26.0
    10. Germany 27.0
    17. Denmark 29.0
    25. Australia 30.5
    34. Italy 32.0
    35. Canada 32.1
    37. France 32.7
    42. Switzerland 33.7
    43. United Kingdom 34.0
    45. Egypt 34.4
    56. India 36.8
    61. Japan 38.1
    68. Israel 39.2
    81. China 41.5
    82. Russia 42.3
    90. Iran 44.5
    93. United States 45.0
    107. Mexico 48.2
    125. Brazil 56.7
    133. South Africa 65.0


    Note: These figures reflect family/household income, not individual income.
    Source: Central Intelligence Agency (2010).
    Attached Images Attached Images

  7. #37
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I didn't realize you do not know the definition of premise. Here you go: "A proposition upon which an argument is based or from which a conclusion is drawn."
    premise - definition of premise by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

    Upsideguy's premise was,
    "many companies have been cutting workers, making the remaining workers work hard for flat to inflation adjusted decreasing wages... and paying the additional profits out in the form of executive bonuses..... "
    It's all about an employee's worth. If a worker earning 30 g's a year, only makes the company 50 g's, then he's getting what he's worth. If an employee is making 5 million a year, but he's making the company 20 million a year, then he's getting what he's worth.

    I think the biggest point that some folks are missing, is that if the company goes belly up everybody is out of work.

  8. #38
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    It's all about an employee's worth. If a worker earning 30 g's a year, only makes the company 50 g's, then he's getting what he's worth. If an employee is making 5 million a year, but he's making the company 20 million a year, then he's getting what he's worth.

    I think the biggest point that some folks are missing, is that if the company goes belly up everybody is out of work.
    And clearly BMW was not in danger of going belly up.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    And clearly BMW was not in danger of going belly up.
    Exactly. I can't understand how people can defend the indefensible. I'm assuming it's because none of their friends, family or loved ones were employed by BMW.

  10. #40
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    Re: BMW layoffs exemplify the evisceration of the middle class

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    And clearly BMW was not in danger of going belly up.
    Thanks to their obvious business savvy.

    10 employees represent over a half million dollars in expense. If those 10 employees aren't going to generate million+ in revenue, then something has got to give.

    Employing people isn't free, ya know?

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