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Thread: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

  1. #121
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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by obvious Child View Post
    Lord T, I think we should modify that. Corporate trickledown does work as corporations ramp up hiring and materials purchases to deal with increased demand. What does not work is rich individual trickle down.
    It does the same thing. They invest more with that extra money, which as you say, "ramp[s] up hiring and materials purchases."

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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    It does the same thing. They invest more with that extra money, which as you say, "ramp[s] up hiring and materials purchases."
    No it does not

    The rich will not invest, if they do not feel they will get a reasonable return on their investment, neither will companies, but that is where returning capital to shareholders comes in either through sharebuybacks or dividends, companies do allow for trickle down generally as most do not sit on excess capital. The rich will sit on excess capital, as they may not have anything better to do with it. Investing in a widgets company when widgets already excess capacity is not something a good investor will do. Instead they can sit on the money and wait untill a good investment comes along
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  3. #123
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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    No it does not

    The rich will not invest, if they do not feel they will get a reasonable return on their investment, neither will companies, but that is where returning capital to shareholders comes in either through sharebuybacks or dividends, companies do allow for trickle down generally as most do not sit on excess capital. The rich will sit on excess capital, as they may not have anything better to do with it. Investing in a widgets company when widgets already excess capacity is not something a good investor will do. Instead they can sit on the money and wait untill a good investment comes along
    Then you have to ask yourself why expansion isn't going on, because profit margins are great. Look at commodity price volatility, wild swings in monetary policy, threats of new taxes and regulations, etc.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

  4. #124
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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Then you have to ask yourself why expansion isn't going on, because profit margins are great. Look at commodity price volatility, wild swings in monetary policy, threats of new taxes and regulations, etc.
    where would expansion come from? Housing still has a huge overhang that will not be worked off for years. Finance, well do don't want that to grow in the U.S. anymore. Tech, the skill set of most unemployed do not fit. Government, that will continue to show a decline as deficits can't continue to rise.

  5. #125
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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    where would expansion come from? Housing still has a huge overhang that will not be worked off for years. Finance, well do don't want that to grow in the U.S. anymore. Tech, the skill set of most unemployed do not fit. Government, that will continue to show a decline as deficits can't continue to rise.
    Seems that there are many companies that are profiting. I would invest in them if there was not all this uncertainty about future costs of production that government is creating.

    Corporate earnings surging — but investors not in the mood - InvestmentNews

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    Seems that there are many companies that are profiting. I would invest in them if there was not all this uncertainty about future costs of production that government is creating.

    Corporate earnings surging — but investors not in the mood - InvestmentNews
    Yes many companies are doing well. A bunch of those are getting an increasing percent of their profits overseas. Watch the earning reports the next few weeks and the commentary about those earnings.

  7. #127
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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    Yes many companies are doing well. A bunch of those are getting an increasing percent of their profits overseas. Watch the earning reports the next few weeks and the commentary about those earnings.
    So what? The point remains that expansion is a perilous endeavor considering the uncertainty about future costs of production. Until we get stability there, we will not see job growth.

    Who shall ascend the hill of the Lord? And who shall stand in his holy place? He who has clean hands and a pure heart, who does not lift up his soul to what is false, and does not swear deceitfully. Psalm 24
    "True law is right reason in agreement with nature . . . Whoever is disobedient is fleeing from himself and denying his human nature [and] will suffer the worst penalties . . ." - Cicero

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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by phattonez View Post
    So what? The point remains that expansion is a perilous endeavor considering the uncertainty about future costs of production. Until we get stability there, we will not see job growth.
    Not sure what you mean by uncertainty about future costs of production. What type of stability are you looking for?

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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Okay I know this may sound unreasonable .. but … we know company profits are up, we know CEO are doing very well, might a wiser thing to do …rather then demonize them, be to sit down and see what their concerns are about investing or expanding ? Then go to work on eliminating those concerns so they would start investing in expansion and jobs ? While I can agree that the middle class spending helps to grow our economy, I just can't see another way to expand that middle class with out their being more well paying (middle class) jobs available … and I also fail to see who is going to create those middle class jobs if not the wealthy and corporate America.

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    Re: The economic recovery turns 2: Feel better yet?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Barbarian View Post
    Okay I know this may sound unreasonable .. but … we know company profits are up, we know CEO are doing very well, might a wiser thing to do …rather then demonize them, be to sit down and see what their concerns are about investing or expanding ? Then go to work on eliminating those concerns so they would start investing in expansion and jobs ? While I can agree that the middle class spending helps to grow our economy, I just can't see another way to expand that middle class with out their being more well paying (middle class) jobs available … and I also fail to see who is going to create those middle class jobs if not the wealthy and corporate America.
    What you say is reasonable. However the challenge is great when you talk about having companies expand headcount in the U.S. Try thinking about it like this. A CEO, who is responsible for ensuring his/her company is profitable looks at where to expand. We are talking about the large middle class, not the relatively few engineers who you can pay a lot to create the next new widget. A good illustration may be the competition between states for jobs. The federal reserve bank of Dallas has reported that 38% of new jobs since the recovery have been added in their location, which is essentially Texas.

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