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Thread: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Upon further review...

    Did you guys ever think to do a closer examination of the two AF and Navy aircraft mentioned in the article?

    This from the article:



    Now, let's look at the offensive profile of these aircraft starting with the Navy's EA-18G Growler.



    Now, the Air Force's F-16CJ:



    If these aircraft are being deployed to strike against air-to-ground missle defenses as the article eludes to, I don't see a problem with their usage because they would be adhering to the U.N. Resolutions agreed upon. However, if they are attacking Libyan military personnel, then we have a problem. According to the article, there is no evidence to support that U.S. military air craft have been used to attack Libyan military forces.

    I call the article as .
    Up 'til now, I've defended Obama on this, because this is the first time I've seen actual evidence that U.S. forces are engaged in direct contact with the enemy.

    Now, if our forces are, "making war", against the Libyan government, Obama needs to get his ass to Congress and get approval, or withdraw.

    This indicates that we aren't involved in a, "non-kinetic", operation. Attacking the enemy is very much a Kinetic excercise.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Hmm, Rev, weren't you the one chastising the President at the beginning of all of this for having less balls than France?
    I was. Which is why I say that either we go big, or go home. Obama isn't going big, here.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Up 'til now, I've defended Obama on this, because this is the first time I've seen actual evidence that U.S. forces are engaged in direct contact with the enemy.

    Now, if our forces are, "making war", against the Libyan government, Obama needs to get his ass to Congress and get approval, or withdraw.

    This indicates that we aren't involved in a, "non-kinetic", operation. Attacking the enemy is very much a Kinetic excercise.
    Again from my post which you quoted:

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice
    If these aircraft are being deployed to strike against air-to-ground missle defenses as the article eludes to, I don't see a problem with their usage because they would be adhering to the U.N. Resolutions agreed upon. However, if they are attacking Libyan military personnel, then we have a problem. According to the article, there is no evidence to support that U.S. military air craft have been used to attack Libyan military forces.
    Now, show in the article that ground forces, i.e., Libyan servicemen, i.e., Libyan military forces, are being attacked by these aircraft.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 07-02-11 at 06:31 PM.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Again from my post which you quoted:



    Now, show in the article that ground forces, i.e., Libyan servicemen, i.e., Libyan military forces, are being attacked by these aircraft.
    You can't seriously believe that those aircraft aren't firing on Libyan troops. Right?

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by Ockham View Post
    Whatever sorties the U.S. is flying, and whatever bombs we're dropping, and whatever drones are launching missiles... it's one thing: Not hostile.
    LOL! Those are love bombs. And if someone accidentally gets hurt we are sorry. All we want is to help those poor people in Libya, bless their hearts. We care so much about them. Sometime love hurts. Sometimes you have to kill people in order to help them. We are only doing what NATO tells us to do.










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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    You can't seriously believe that those aircraft aren't firing on Libyan troops. Right?
    What I believe isn't the issue. What's actually happening is! So, unless you can point to an article that states clearly and definitively that U.S. warplanes including Predetor Drones are firing on Libyan troops, armed or unarmed, you have nothing to go by as far as the argument of direct hostilities are concerned.

    If these NATO-led U.S. military aircraft are destroying stationary missle platforms as opposed to mobile missle platforms, I have no problem with that. If mobile, I would probably be against it since mobile missle platforms are manned by military personnel. As such, if mobile units are hit it stands to reason that military personnel will also be injuried or killed. Now, here's where I have to argue with myself: "Do I stand by my humanitarian values and defend even the Libyan military against undue harm, or do I defend the larger argument - the pursuit of democracy and the protection of those who are fighting for it?

    What to do, what to do?
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 07-02-11 at 08:53 PM.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Hmm, Rev, weren't you the one chastising the President at the beginning of all of this for having less balls than France?


    Don't remember, however i would likely have made fun of over "chastizing" him in that case. Here I'm actually "chastizing" the now all but silent anti-war hoard.
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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Don't remember, however i would likely have made fun of over "chastizing" him in that case. Here I'm actually "chastizing" the now all but silent anti-war hoard.
    Confirmation bias. Numerous anti-war people have expressed anger at these actions.
    He touched her over her bra and underpants, she says, and guided her hand to touch him over his underwear
    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    We’ll say what? Something like “nothing happened” ... Yeah, we might say something like that.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    What I believe isn't the issue. What's actually happening is! So, unless you can point to an article that states clearly and definitively that U.S. warplanes including Predetor Drones are firing on Libyan troops, armed or unarmed, you have nothing to go by as far as the argument of direct hostilities are concerned.

    If these NATO-led U.S. military aircraft are destroying stationary missle platforms as opposed to mobile missle platforms, I have no problem with that. If mobile, I would probably be against it since mobile missle platforms are manned by military personnel. As such, if mobile units are hit it stands to reason that military personnel will also be injuried or killed. Now, here's where I have to argue with myself: "Do I stand by my humanitarian values and defend even the Libyan military against undue harm, or do I defend the larger argument - the pursuit of democracy and the protection of those who are fighting for it?

    What to do, what to do?
    This is another one of those moments where common sense has to come into play.

    The OP claims that American combat aircraft are suppressing Libyan anti-aircraft fire. Those AAA batteries are manned by human beings. Unless you can point out where Qaddafi has a completely robotocized AAA system, it's obvious that we're not only firing on Libyan troops, but we're also putting American service members in harm's way, which Obama said wasn't happening. Believe it, or not, those attacking anti-aircraft positions add an element of danger to a sortie.

    Plausible deniability just isn't going to work this time.

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    Re: AFRICOM: AF, Navy still flying Libya missions

    Quote Originally Posted by Deuce View Post
    Confirmation bias. Numerous anti-war people have expressed anger at these actions.





    Really? Where are thr Obam=hitler posters. The massive war protests? Please. Most have remained silent.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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