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Exxon finds 700 million barrels in the GOM

I would make the same argument, either way. it's just common sense.

By the same token, anyone who doesn't have anything vested in the oilfield can't argue the topic objectively, either; against oil and gas production.

The reason I ask the anti-oilers if they are investing any money into green energy, is because if it's such an awesome idea, they should be dumping every spare dime they have into green energy companies and recruiting more investors, so the industry can grow.

I think you don't understand the meaning of the word "objectivity." One can be objective regardless of their involvement or lack of involvement in oil, it just takes a clear mind, someone who looks at facts and facts alone and who can analyize them without bias towards any outcome. What you are trying to say is that without some involvement in oil in some way, an objective person may not have all the facts or understand them and therefore their opinion, while still objectivity if they aren't biased to any outcome, is inaccurate because they lacked facts or didn't understand them.

Now we can both agree the US should be energy independant, or at least as close as possible and always trying to get closer. Its good for business, jobs, and its good for foreign policy as we can easier avoid messy ties with "questionable" allies like the Saudis. It would give us much more freedom on the international stage. Who cares where that energy would come from as long as its safe? Its obvious we can't be energy independant on oil alone, this recent find won't accomplish that by a long shot, so while I AGREE we should drill and explore US oil, including the Gulf. I also think its wildly foolish and impratical to not invest on potentially future sources of energy.

Is that not reasonable and realistic?
 
I would make the same argument, either way. it's just common sense.

It's status as "common sense" is certainly up for debate, but fair enough.

By the same token, anyone who doesn't have anything vested in the oilfield can't argue the topic objectively, either; against oil and gas production.

How do you figure that having no conflicts of interest makes one unable to argue objectively?

The reason I ask the anti-oilers if they are investing any money into green energy, is because if it's such an awesome idea, they should be dumping every spare dime they have into green energy companies and recruiting more investors, so the industry can grow.

I think it would depend on their situation, actually. If they are living basicaly paycheck to paycheck, then they shouldn't be investing all of their extra cash in anything just yet. They need to build up their reserves first before they start dumping everything into the market. If they have a solid base of reserves to go on, they should be smart, diversified in their approach to investment because, while green energy in general is a good idea for investment, it is not a single investment option and like anything, there wil be big winners, big losers and everything in between.

For example, which solar panel company is worth investing in? Well Germany has just decided to phase out all of its nuclear power and move towards solar power (pretty good news for solar energy companies after the recent announcements that European subsidies could be going away). First Solar (currently trading at 119) is Germany's largest supplier of solar panels and they are trading close to their 52 week lows right now, and LDK Solar operates in Germany as well and looks like a protentially good investment as well, possibly better if they can perform like they have recently over the long haul.

Like any investment, doing your homework is the key. Investing in first solar a ferw years ago when they were trading at $20 a share would have been a killer iunvestment, regardless of what your political views are. Try and pick the "winner" and you can profit nicely.

But someone shouldn't be investing based only on their moral support for the technology involved. That's just bad investing. That can be a factor how one invests, but making wise investments is still important. If someone doesn't know how to invest their money smartly, they should leave it to someone who knows what they are doing.

And at the same time, anyone with some investment savvy should be looking at green companies and saying "**** the political bull****" right now and putting a some of their money into that kind of technology in a smart fashion. They are good investments if one picks correctly. First solar, for example, was trading at $20 a share in 2006. People who bought then had the potential of getting out when the stock hit $170 a share a few months back for a massive profit.
 
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We all use oil, even those of you that are anti-oil use oil so finding more is a good thing. As technology advances more oil becomes accessible. Yes someday the demand may exceed the supply but then again it may not. The same brains that allow us to figure out ways to get more oil also allow us to figure out ways to use it more efficiently. Eventually the oil supply will be used up but that’s a long ways off. In the meantime other forms of energy will come on line and there will be a smooth transition to these new forms of energy. Of course this scenario depends on rational people running the show not alarmist panicked sky is falling people who literally want to put the cart ahead of the horse. If they have their way we are in for a forced rough transition that will destroy economies and ruin possibly even end lives.
 
We all use oil, even those of you that are anti-oil use oil so finding more is a good thing. As technology advances more oil becomes accessible.

Until it doesn't. Oil is finite ya know.

"Technology is great, but it can't find what's not there. In the last five years, we consumed 27 billion barrels of oil a year, but the oil industry discovered only three billion barrels a year. So only one barrel was replaced for every nine we used.". - L.B. Magoon Report for US Geological Survey

Yes someday the demand may exceed the supply but then again it may not.

You have GOT to be kidding.

Eventually the oil supply will be used up...

Oh, good, you were kidding.

In the meantime other forms of energy will come on line and there will be a smooth transition to these new forms of energy.

What alternative energy replaces petrochemical fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and fungicides that artificially boosts crop yields on which our massive population now depends? (hint, plugging electric currents into the ground does not work)

Of course this scenario depends on rational people running the show not alarmist panicked sky is falling people who literally want to put the cart ahead of the horse. If they have their way we are in for a forced rough transition that will destroy economies and ruin possibly even end lives.

You really don't get it. Without oil-based conventional agriculture, billions of people have to starve. We literally have been turning the energy contained in oil into the food that we eat. When oil supply diminishes, even gradually over time, both food and the oil we use to make it and ship it become prohibitively expensive, which necessarily causes a food crisis. This isn't like Y2K or global warming. It's guaranteed, concrete arithmetic. Cause and effect.

If you want to just automatically write it all off as alarmism and sit comfortably in denial, be my guest. But if you want to actually read any of the literature (there's simply tons) that will illuminate this a bit more for you, let me know, and I'll point you to some.
 
Until it doesn't. Oil is finite ya know.

"Technology is great, but it can't find what's not there. In the last five years, we consumed 27 billion barrels of oil a year, but the oil industry discovered only three billion barrels a year. So only one barrel was replaced for every nine we used.". - L.B. Magoon Report for US Geological Survey



You have GOT to be kidding.



Oh, good, you were kidding.



What alternative energy replaces petrochemical fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and fungicides that artificially boosts crop yields on which our massive population now depends? (hint, plugging electric currents into the ground does not work)



You really don't get it. Without oil-based conventional agriculture, billions of people have to starve. We literally have been turning the energy contained in oil into the food that we eat. When oil supply diminishes, even gradually over time, both food and the oil we use to make it and ship it become prohibitively expensive, which necessarily causes a food crisis. This isn't like Y2K or global warming. It's guaranteed, concrete arithmetic. Cause and effect.

If you want to just automatically write it all off as alarmism and sit comfortably in denial, be my guest. But if you want to actually read any of the literature (there's simply tons) that will illuminate this a bit more for you, let me know, and I'll point you to some.

Yes I will write it off as alarmism. The tone of your response is alarmist and full of panic. We are nowhere near running out of oil and are finding more all the time. What you couldn’t seem to grasp from my first post was that as we get more efficient at using oil and more efficient at finding it, the point when there is no more oil to find gets farther away not closer and as other forms of energy come on line and we use less oil we may indeed never run out. It may become obsolete before it’s gone completely, that’s what I mean by we may never run out. When I was just a kid one of the original old surfers taught me to surf and taught me a lesson I have lived by ever since. He said “Panic will kill you. Remember, the human body wants to float, when a big wave rolls you around and bounces you off the bottom just relax, don’t thrash around, the calmer you are the longer you can hold your breath, you will come up.” There’s a lesson here that goes far beyond being held under water in big surf, think about it. That’s precisely what so many of you are doing, thrashing around like a man in panic drowning in 4 feet of water, it happens.
 
Until it doesn't. Oil is finite ya know.

"Technology is great, but it can't find what's not there. In the last five years, we consumed 27 billion barrels of oil a year, but the oil industry discovered only three billion barrels a year. So only one barrel was replaced for every nine we used.". - L.B. Magoon Report for US Geological Survey



You have GOT to be kidding.



Oh, good, you were kidding.



What alternative energy replaces petrochemical fertilizers, pesticides, herbicides and fungicides that artificially boosts crop yields on which our massive population now depends? (hint, plugging electric currents into the ground does not work)



You really don't get it. Without oil-based conventional agriculture, billions of people have to starve. We literally have been turning the energy contained in oil into the food that we eat. When oil supply diminishes, even gradually over time, both food and the oil we use to make it and ship it become prohibitively expensive, which necessarily causes a food crisis. This isn't like Y2K or global warming. It's guaranteed, concrete arithmetic. Cause and effect.

If you want to just automatically write it all off as alarmism and sit comfortably in denial, be my guest. But if you want to actually read any of the literature (there's simply tons) that will illuminate this a bit more for you, let me know, and I'll point you to some.

The planet is going to just stop producing oil? I doubt that's going to happen.
 
So, we're going to use this find to supply the world with oil? Or, just use it ourselves and put Americans back to work?
Generally, the company who has the rights to the oil sells it on the world market. There's not really an "our oil" or a "their oil." It's all more or less fungible.

More good news is that as the price of oil goes up, the amount oil that it's financially feasible to retrieve will keep going up. Yay high oil prices!
 
Generally, the company who has the rights to the oil sells it on the world market. There's not really an "our oil" or a "their oil." It's all more or less fungible.

More good news is that as the price of oil goes up, the amount oil that it's financially feasible to retrieve will keep going up. Yay high oil prices!

well, this is where commons sense comes into play. It's most cost effective to take oil from the GOM and refine it in...America!

Have you noticed the pipelines that are running out of the GOM? Well, maybe you haven't, since you're not from here.
 
What do you suppose the timeline on making oil is?

A long ass time. Do you think the planet stopped producing oil, though? new pools are maturing all the time.
 
well, this is where commons sense comes into play. It's most cost effective to take oil from the GOM and refine it in...America!
Have you noticed the pipelines that are running out of the GOM? Well, maybe you haven't, since you're not from here.
Point being that for many practical intents and purposes, oil is dumped into the same big-ass bucket. Sure the actual molecules of oil are moved as little as possible to help increase profits, but the system is such that there's no real difference to the market. Once the oil is out of the ground it is supplying the world with oil.
 
Generally, the company who has the rights to the oil sells it on the world market. There's not really an "our oil" or a "their oil." It's all more or less fungible.

More good news is that as the price of oil goes up, the amount oil that it's financially feasible to retrieve will keep going up. Yay high oil prices!

US domestically produced oil is generally restricted from entering the world market (Canada being an exception)

It is currently a rather meaningless law though given the how much oil the US imports
 
Just recently, as I pointed out.

Good god you really don't understand just how much of this stuff we go through...

It seriously never occurred to me that there might be people under the impression that oil might not run out.
 
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The United States uses about 7 Billion barrels of oil per year so this won't last very long at all.

We need to open every possible field offshore or on ASAP

Sweet, we'll have oil for a year :rolleyes:

You really don't get it. Without oil-based conventional agriculture, billions of people have to starve. We literally have been turning the energy contained in oil into the food that we eat. When oil supply diminishes, even gradually over time, both food and the oil we use to make it and ship it become prohibitively expensive, which necessarily causes a food crisis. This isn't like Y2K or global warming. It's guaranteed, concrete arithmetic. Cause and effect.

If you want to just automatically write it all off as alarmism and sit comfortably in denial, be my guest. But if you want to actually read any of the literature (there's simply tons) that will illuminate this a bit more for you, let me know, and I'll point you to some.

True, but there are already other organic based products that produce similar results and hydrogen can be used to make some fertilizer. However, the fact that so much of our lives is dependent on oil byproducts is were peak-oil becomes an issue. Everything you have in your house is likely to contain some byproduct of oil in it.
 
Good god you really don't understand just how much of this stuff we go through...

It seriously never occurred to me that there might be people under the impression that oil might not run out.

Why aren't you sinking all your spare cash into green companies?
 
Matured means it there. And, if it's there, we can find it.

Yes of course


But it doesnt mean that it was not there 1000 years ago and all of a sudden formed.

Peak oil generally means that all of the easy oil has been found, making the remaining oil hard to get and expensive in comparision. The Oil sands fits that idea, so does the oil brazil has found in the deep ocean far from its coast. Ghawar, and other massive finds during the 20-60's represent the golden age of oil. Where sticking the drill in the ground could quite often provide good returns. Now it is far more expensive to search for it, and to drill for it
 
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