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Thread: The results are in on social security

  1. #361
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by OpportunityCost View Post
    Bad argument is bad. Almost every single change proposed to Social Security has been to means test it--and no one has complained and all seem to agree its a needed change.
    I like this idea. Once social security is just another welfare program in the minds of the American taxpayers the easier it will be to cut it to the bone, and eventually end it. This would make the perception finally match the reality. I think this is brilliant.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I read a few and they don't specify where the funds come from, guess it's anyone's guess....like your warresitors.org guess.
    They come from the general fund, which includes the SS trust funds. When that is all used up it goes onto our national debt. Are you aware that without this drawdown of the trust funds, there would be a 2.7 trillion dollar surplus in SS?

    So it is not accurate to say we have a SS crisis. What we have had since 1981 is a general fund crisis.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  3. #363
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    They come from the general fund, which includes the SS trust funds. When that is all used up it goes onto our national debt. Are you aware that without this drawdown of the trust funds, there would be a 2.7 trillion dollar surplus in SS?

    So it is not accurate to say we have a SS crisis. What we have had since 1981 is a general fund crisis.
    Can you point me at something that shows the SS trust funds are included in the general fund?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Can you point me at something that shows the SS trust funds are included in the general fund?
    I already posted this a couple pages back: "Since the Greenspan Commission in the early 1980s, Social Security has cumulatively collected far more in payroll taxes dedicated to the program than it has paid out to recipients—nearly $2.4 trillion by 2008. This annual surplus is credited to Social Security trust funds that hold special non-marketable Treasury securities, and this surplus amount is commonly referred to as the "Social Security Trust Fund". The proceeds are paid into the U.S. Treasury where they may be used for other government purposes."
    Last edited by Catawba; 07-26-11 at 11:07 PM.
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    You attributed my post for me, and the if you are talking about excess money in terms of the federal budget than you are talking about a different thing. I'm talking about SS. Social security is funded by FICA, and 2010 was the first time social security paid out more than it brought in since 1985.

    Now hop on your horse and go get some manners...and a clue.
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    Nah,i like to see you dance.The last time we had someone with your steps his name was Stinger
    Moderator's Warning:
    The results are in on social securityBOTH of you knock it off or you'll be dancing right out of this thread.
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  6. #366
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    I already posted this a couple pages back: "Since the Greenspan Commission in the early 1980s, Social Security has cumulatively collected far more in payroll taxes dedicated to the program than it has paid out to recipients—nearly $2.4 trillion by 2008. This annual surplus is credited to Social Security trust funds that hold special non-marketable Treasury securities, and this surplus amount is commonly referred to as the "Social Security Trust Fund". The proceeds are paid into the U.S. Treasury where they may be used for other government purposes."
    Well, technically, other government needs is not necessarily the wars. Regardless, this isn't exactly the same things as "robing ss to pay for them". IMO, of course.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Well, technically, other government needs is not necessarily the wars. Regardless, this isn't exactly the same things as "robing ss to pay for them". IMO, of course.
    When Bush told the American people they were protected, and then used them to help fund the tax cuts and the wars, I don't know what you would call it other than robbing.

    "In his first State of the Union address on February 3, 2001, Bush said, "To make sure the retirement savings of America's seniors are not diverted in any other program, my budget protects all $2.6 trillion of the Social Security surplus for Social Security, and for Social Security alone." Four days later, Bush said, "We're going to keep the promise of Social Security and keep the government from raiding the Social Security surplus."

    Because of all the rhetoric and news coverage of the Social Security trust fund issue during the campaign, and in the early months of the George W. Bush presidency, the American people came to believe that the Social Security trust fund was no longer being raided. But nothing changed with the inauguration of George W. Bush. Despite his pledge to protect the Social Security money, Bush spent every dime of Social Security surplus revenue that came in during his presidency. He used it to fund his big tax cuts for the rich, and much of it was spent on wars.

    The news media had given extensive coverage to the Social Security debate in the 2000 election campaign, and to President Bush's early promises to not raid the trust fund. However, Bush's failure to honor his promises, with regard to Social Security, just never seemed to get much news coverage, leaving most Americans to believe that the raiding of the trust fund ended after George W. Bush took office. On the contrary, Bush raided and spent a total of $1.37 trillion of Social Security surplus during his eight years as president. In his last year, he spent $192.2 billion, which averages out to more than $526 million per day.

    During a speech on April 5, 2005 in Parkersburg, West Virginia, Bush openly admitted to the fact that all of the Social Security surplus revenue had been spent. He said, "There is no trust fund, just IOUs that I saw firsthand that future generations will pay—will pay for either in higher taxes, or reduced benefits, or cuts to other critical government programs."
    News Articles: No Money in the Social Security Trust Fund
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  8. #368
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    kinda looks like President Clinton's ex secretary of labor has the social security problem figured out.



    < Back in 1983, the ceiling was set so the Social Security payroll tax would hit 90 percent of all wages covered by Social Security. That 90 percent figure was built into the Greenspan Commission’s fixes. The Commission assumed that, as the ceiling rose with inflation, the Social Security payroll tax would continue to hit 90 percent of total income.>


    <Today, though, the Social Security payroll tax hits only about 84 percent of total income.>

    <If we want to go back to 90 percent, the ceiling on income subject to the Social Security tax would need to be raised to $180,000.>


    <Presto. Social Security’s long-term (beyond 26 years from now) problem would be solved.>

    Robert Reich (The Only Social Security Reform Worth Considering: Raising the Ceiling on Income Subject to It)
    he is doing the same thing you have been doing - assuming that the US Government will be running enough of a surplus to cover the paper in the trust fund. we aren't.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Not directly, or in the manner described by your extremely biased site. Social Security money is routinely used for a whole host of things.
    "things" that are not its intended purpose so we should cut those "things" BEFORE we stop sending out ss checks imo.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Cat, this doesn't corroborate your war resister's post....and also from your same link:



    This is including Homeland Security as part of defense. As I'm sure you know, Homeland Security includes Fire and emergency services, Customs, Coast Gaurd and most major law enforcement agencies, FEMA....etc.
    and yet we have 16 million illegals just walking across our borders. i guess we know how WELL that money is being spent.

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