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Thread: The results are in on social security

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    It is a contract with American workers and retirees. What we need to do is raise the cap on FICA and do what Gore suggested, lock the funds from General fund use. Problem solved. At the beginning of the Bush Administration we had a $2.6 trillion dollar surplus in SS revenue.
    You would have loved Ponzi. He was a very nice guy. A ponzi scheme is still a ponzi scheme. It requires more and more suckers as time goes on. We are running out of suckers.

    There has never been a surplus. It is a lie. You have been lied to and like most suckers you prefer to believe it. Fine with me. I can discount anything you type here.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by toddwv View Post
    You mention "defense". So how many out of the last 10 major "conflicts", we don't declare war anymore because that requires an act of Congress instead of a personal edict by the Commander in Chief., were direct defense of the sovereignty of the US?
    I know there is a reasonable question in there somewhere.

    Are you asking me to tell you how many of the last ten conflicts were fought with a declaration of war? Name the conflicts and let's run through them if that is important to you. Or are you asking how many were important to us? You list the conflicts and let's go through them.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    It will be when people start starving, unless you’re OK with fellow citizens dying while standing in line waiting for a bowl of soup and a couple of crackers.
    Thats what other government programs, i.e food stamps and private charity i.e. food banks is for.



    Many of the people borrowing from there 401k,s thought what they were doing at the time was the intelligent thing to do (feed hungry children).Yeh, I know, in winger land that is an unintelligent thing to do.
    See above

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    i'm just not sure what you are saying - are you arguing that rates will fall under a sales tax?
    If demand falls, which should happen under a national sales tax, then rates should as well.

  4. #144
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    Re: The results are in on social security

    xpiher

    Thats what other government programs, i.e food stamps private charity i.e. food banks is for.
    We have a record of 31.8 million fellow countrymen receiving food stamps so far this year. So what do our compassionate, newly minted, house republicans do when they first take office? Why reduce women, Infants and children Programs by $500 million as part of this year's budget OF COURSE!!

    Now lets hear from someone that says
    “Not my problem. (Post #137) “
    In answer to
    ” What do you think will be the effect of that when these people get to retirement age? “

    Show us the Compassionate Conservative Charity, which you want to slough our 31.8 million fellow countrymen who now receive food stamps (which average $115 a month), off on.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    What is your point donc? Conservatives are not compassionate? Is that all?

    I understand that some people do not have jobs. I know some people that are on food stamps. All of them have cell phones. Most of them have cable and/or internet. Would they really starve to death if not for food stamps?
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 06-15-11 at 01:32 AM.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    cpwill
    1. yes, even if we take off the cap and
    2. paying money back into the SS Trust fund requires that the US General budget run a surplus of hundreds of billions of dollars every year from here on out - do you see us running hundreds of billions in surpluses any time soon?


    One big problem with Social Security funding can be traced to fact that on the top of the income pile, sets a whole bunch of people and they are growing, even during the GREAT BUSH RECESSION that hit the cap limit in about a month.

    Then you have the shrinking middle class, or what’s left of it, going the other way.SSSoo… deduct SS from ALL income - including interest and investment income. Thata work.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    What is your point donc? Conservatives are not compassionate? Is that all?

    I understand that some people do not have jobs. I know some people that are on food stamps. All of them have cell phones. Most of them have cable and/or internet. Would they really starve to death if not for food stamps?
    Read post #137, thru post #144. Hint, look at the posts of xpiher that I quoted with your blinders off.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    Read post #137, thru post #144. Hint, look at the posts of xpiher that I quoted with your blinders off.
    I read them. You sort of made two points. Your first point was to remove the SS cap. Couple of questions on this:

    1) Just generally speaking, should people who want and need a type of insurance pay for said insurance? (this one's easy)
    2) Should people who do not and will not need a type of insurance be required to pay for said insurance anyway? If so, why?

    Your second point had something to do with people starving in soup lines and people borrowing against their 401(k)s to feed hungry children. I couldn't really discern this point, so you may wish to clarify. But my main questions is this: Is it really true that the folks borrowing against their retirement funds are doing so to feed their hungry children? Can you cite support of this claim anywhere? I would be utterly baffled by such a fact, if demonstrated. Considering 401(k)s are things people with jobs have, and so food to the kids should be the one of the very last things parents found themselves unable to afford on their own.
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 06-15-11 at 01:59 AM.

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Neomalthusian

    Is it really true that the folks borrowing against their retirement funds are doing so to feed their hungry children?
    I believe I read in a US News and Report that approximately 28 percent of 401(k) participants had an outstanding loan in 2010.

    I believe that the author was Aon Hewitt.

    Considering 401(k)s are things people with jobs have, and so food to the kids should be the one of the very last things parents found themselves unable to afford on their own.

    Your right, “401(k)s are things people with jobs have “ but the latest jobs report by the bls has the number of unemployed at 13.9 million and the unemployment rate was 9.1 percent and 28% of that number comes to pretty close to four million many of whom have 401(k)s. Now why do you think that unemployed Americans would be tapping their 401(k)s?

    I’m thinking that it’s a pretty desperate act, considering the price that they pay; check this link out.
    Last edited by Donc; 06-15-11 at 03:05 AM.
    The haggardness of poverty is everywhere seen contrasted with the sleekness of wealth, the exhorted labor of some compensating for the idleness of others, wretched hovels by the side of stately colonnades, the rags of indigence blended with the ensigns of opulence; in a word, the most useless profusion in the midst of the most urgent wants.Jean-Baptiste Say

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    Re: The results are in on social security

    Quote Originally Posted by donc View Post
    We have a record of 31.8 million fellow countrymen receiving food stamps so far this year. So what do our compassionate, newly minted, house republicans do when they first take office? Why reduce women, Infants and children Programs by $500 million as part of this year's budget OF COURSE!!

    Now lets hear from someone that says In answer to


    Show us the Compassionate Conservative Charity, which you want to slough our 31.8 million fellow countrymen who now receive food stamps (which average $115 a month), off on.
    I think it funny you put me in the same category as repubs. I support social welfare programs and a livable wage, just like Hayek.

    SS is simply just useless. There isn't any reason why a private company cannot do the something thing that the government fails to do, prevent people from taking the money out. You can easily have a contract with a bank that x amount of dollars will be taken from your check and put into a fund that is inaccessible, by anyone, until you are age 65. Unlike the gov, you could sue the bank to get the money should it "vanish"

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Your second point had something to do with people starving in soup lines and people borrowing against their 401(k)s to feed hungry children. I couldn't really discern this point, so you may wish to clarify. But my main questions is this: Is it really true that the folks borrowing against their retirement funds are doing so to feed their hungry children? Can you cite support of this claim anywhere? I would be utterly baffled by such a fact, if demonstrated. Considering 401(k)s are things people with jobs have, and so food to the kids should be the one of the very last things parents found themselves unable to afford on their own.
    401ks follow you even when you aren't employed. Most of the middle class that lost their jobs have almost completely exhausted, if not exhausted, their entire life savings while looking for work. The problem with SS tax is that the government has done the same thing, and will do it again even if it was illegal.

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