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Thread: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I don't suggest a vaccum, but that this particular plan isn't a winner. It isn't about comparison. It is the plan standing on its own.
    no, plans do not exist in a vacuum, and must be compared to the alternatives available.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    We start the program in 10 years because if we wait any longer the whole damn thing goes down, and takes the rest of the country with it. 10 years is about as long as we can push out without drastic and painful fixes elsewhere, likely to current seniors.

    CP you just pull this stuff out of your head dont you...wow, your the worst doom and gloomer ive seen. Medicare can be repaired forever...the teaparty wants it gone PERIOD and they will spout the same doom and gloom and dread you do to try and make it happen....


    he reason repubs start 10 years is because they don't want to pay for it. It can easily be made solvent for another 20-30 years (starting today) if money was taken from other programs and feed into it. If Ryan's plan didn't start at 55, seniors wouldn't be up in arms about it.

    That statement is mostly true....but as a senior who is active in a few orgs in florida with seniors....its more that they LIED to try and flamboozle it through that got everyones arse up down here...Over and over they told us...It doesnt effect anyone 55 and above nothing changes ever for any of you....even their head cheerer cpwill repeated that over and over in threads....and the truth is that is a LIE...for 55 yr olds it changes immediately upon them being eligible at 65, then it changes for all of us in 10 yrs....that and the huge tax breaks for the richest americans while they stick it to everyone else....

    Again, Deficit reduction plan ONLY that has pain from the top to the botton and right to left....that includes the richest americans and corporations and the middleclass.
    Stop loopholes that allow GE to piss in the entire countries face...14.9 billion profit and got a 300 million tax credit from US..plus subsidies....they dont need a TAX Cut to start paying some taxs and for us to close some of their loopholes.....yanno this ryan plan is totally full of **** seriously...any working man that falls for this needs a lobotamy
    you post this crap, i demonstrate how you are incorrect, i ask you for your evidence of your claims, and your response is to flee to another thread and post the same crap....

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    So the Republicans need to just say yes to raising the debt ceiling because Democrats want and need that. But if they want to throw in any of their ideas into the bill it means they aren't willing to compromise? Should they just sit back and approve of raising the debt ceiling again because Democrats want them to? I'm sorry, but I see this as Dems not willing to compromise with anything the Republicans might want. They are the House majority party, there will need to be some bi-partisan talks and compromising.
    Please remind me, was it 7 or 8 times the debt limit was raised under Bush??


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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    honestly I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't more. Bush was a pretty big spender.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    you post this crap, i demonstrate how you are incorrect, i ask you for your evidence of your claims, and your response is to flee to another thread and post the same crap....
    Flee nowhere...im not answering your same question over and over, you are incorrect...you show me where a person 55 nothing changes for them under ryans plan...when it CLEARLY states in ryans plan in 10 yrs premium support starts..which means a person 55 everything changes for them...thats number 1...now AGAIN for the last time...abolishing the inheritance tax and the capitol gains tax benefits ONLY the richest americans and has no business in a deficit reduction plan that inflicts pain on senior citizens and the poor...
    Cp ...you need to be a bit less partisan and not cheerlead for every single teaparty talking point...to hear you tell it whatever they say comes from the mouth of god and is gospel...sorry buddy I was like that and I outgrew it...

    http://www.cepr.net/index.php/blogs/...or-health-care


    http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com...medicare-plan/

    - Here's how the Congressional Budget Office looked at that in dollars.
    - CBO estimated that in 2022, the government would allot $8000 for a 65-year-old, to go toward buying a health insurance plan.
    - CBO estimated that the 65-year-old would then pay an additional $12,500 for that plan and for all out-of-pocket costs.
    Last edited by lpast; 06-05-11 at 10:51 PM.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    no, plans do not exist in a vacuum, and must be compared to the alternatives available.
    No. Not liking either doesn't make one good. Not even better really. It's not about a vaccum. It's about start over as this won't do.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No. Not liking either doesn't make one good. Not even better really. It's not about a vaccum. It's about start over as this won't do.
    nothing will be "good" in the sense that we will get more in benefits.

    but this is a question of political contest, and so yes, it comes down to a question of whose medicine you prefer, and whose you think most likely to save the patient.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by lpast View Post
    Flee nowhere...im not answering your same question over and over, you are incorrect...you show me where a person 55 nothing changes for them under ryans plan...when it CLEARLY states in ryans plan in 10 yrs premium support starts..which means a person 55 everything changes for them
    55 is the cut off for the old plan. if you are 54 today you will enroll under the new.

    but that's not what you claim - you have claimed that it changes Medicare for the worse for current retirees, to the tune of hundreds of dollars a month.

    abolishing the inheritance tax and the capitol gains tax benefits ONLY the richest americans
    this is wildly incorrect. Alan Greenspan testified before Congress that repealing the Capital Gains Tax would cause the investment of Trillions of extra dollars in the American economy in a matter of months.

    If you want to reduce the deficit, you need to increase revenue. If you want to increase revenue, you have to increase GDP. If you want to increase GDP, getting rid of the capital gains tax is an excellent way to do it.

    .....

    but you know what? that whole bit is moot.

    because the House 2012 Budget does not eliminate the death tax, and it does not eliminate the capital gains tax

    you have confused the 2012 Budget with Ryan's previous work, the Roadmap For America; which has never been passed by the House, but which does contain the elimination of both of those taxes.


    now.


    you can either admit that you were wrong, or you can run away to another thread in a day... or three... and post the same false claim.


    we'll see what you choose.

    Cp ...you need to be a bit less partisan and not cheerlead for every single teaparty talking point...to hear you tell it whatever they say comes from the mouth of god and is gospel...sorry buddy I was like that and I outgrew it...
    I called for the election of Obama because I wanted to punish the Republican Party. I wrote long, angry letters to the local, state, and national party headquarters. I sent money to anyone running against a Republican incumbent that I thought had a chance and would be a better replacement. The Republican Party is a pack of fools - but this One Thing they seem to have gotten mostly right.

    - Here's how the Congressional Budget Office looked at that in dollars.
    - CBO estimated that in 2022, the government would allot $8000 for a 65-year-old, to go toward buying a health insurance plan.
    That's because the CBO scores dynamically - they either dont' or can't take into effect actual changes in the market so they have to assume current trends continue. that's why they overestimated Medicare D to the tune of 41% - because they don't factor in for the natural changes in a market that occur when you introduce choice.

    - CBO estimated that the 65-year-old would then pay an additional $12,500 for that plan and for all out-of-pocket costs.
    unless of course they couldn't afford it in which case the government picked up the tab - I notice you don't mention the $7,800 extra that the government provides in premium support for those who means -test as needing it.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    nothing will be "good" in the sense that we will get more in benefits.

    but this is a question of political contest, and so yes, it comes down to a question of whose medicine you prefer, and whose you think most likely to save the patient.
    What you don't see is the answer is neither. It is not we'll take the one over the other. The answer is neither is good enough. And because of the reasoning, the one more likley to inspire voter turnout, one could fair better in a poll, but not at the polls, where it counts. However, the point is neither gets support. So no one can claim victory.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: McConnell: Paul Ryan Medicare Plan 'On The Table' In Debt Ceiling Discussions

    I do not understand Republicans. The populace, well at least those who actually have something to lose under Ryan's plan, have rejected his plan. McConnell wants to make this plan the GOP starting point in debt ceiling negotiation? And there are people on here saying they will win 2012?

    I am comfortable with them having this position completely.

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