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Thread: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by rocket88 View Post
    Considering death is a natural part of life...I'd consider it helping people make informed decisions about when to stop care.

    As it is now, Medicare will pay for any and every life-extending technique that exists, and probably some that don't. What it doesn't pay for is for you to have a conversation with your doctor about how you want to die. That was what the "death panel" provision changed. It simply made this conversation coverable the same as hooking you up to the little machine that goes "beep."

    I thought Conservatives were all about having the freedom to make your own choices, and to be empowered in areas like health care. Not in this case, I guess.
    Some conservatives don't notice the similarities between their own entitlements and those of others. Some don't see the fundamental flaws inherent in both private and public health insurances. When a 3rd party administers disbursements for whole populations of people, they have to ration it somewhere and in some fashion. This destroys choice. Inability to afford something doesn't destroy choice, at least not in the way that handing over the entire checkbook to a stranger does.

    Health insurance at its core is communistic. Keeping the industry
    for-profit is just sprinkling it with artificial flavor of capitalism. Extreme as it seems to us this day and age, the only move that ultimately will keep these costs down for good is eliminating health insurance altogether and returning to cash-only.
    Last edited by Neomalthusian; 05-25-11 at 08:07 PM.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Some conservatives don't notice the similarities between their own entitlements and those of others. Some don't see the fundamental flaws inherent in both private and public health insurances. When a 3rd party administers disbursements for whole populations of people, they have to ration it somewhere and in some fashion. This destroys choice. Inability to afford something doesn't destroy choice, at least not in the way that handing over the entire checkbook to a stranger does.
    Given that one cannot choose what is not available, it absolutely destroys choice for the very same reasons.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Given that one cannot choose what is not available, it absolutely destroys choice for the very same reasons.
    Again, choice is preserved when we decide how to save and spend our own money. Lamborghini is not destroying my sense of choice by pricing out of my range. Choice is destroyed when a third and/or fourth party manages an entire class of expenditures for us, and doubly destroyed when government makes non-participation in that scheme illegal.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Again, choice is preserved when we decide how to save and spend our own money. Lamborghini is not destroying my sense of choice by pricing out of my range. Choice is destroyed when a third and/or fourth partsy manages an entire class of expenditures for us, and doubly destroyed when government makes non-participation in that scheme illegal.
    And you would be wrong. Because this car is outside of your financial range, you have no reasonable choice for that car. It may not destroy your SENSE of choice, but it does remove it from what is available to you, so it remove it in fact.

    In the libertarian system, we theoretically have all sorts of choices, but if its not available in real life, than its just on paper and has no real world value.

    However, this does not mean a lack of choice is a bad thing in and of itself. I cannot choose to have fairy dust be generated by my intestines and come out of my butt, but that does not server a purpose for me, so it does not matter. Alternatively, if I have no reasonable choice to do something harmful to myself, than it is for my good (I have no access to possess a lot of material which may be harmful to me, like something radioactive). Choice alone does not make a system good or bad, it depends on the situation in which that choice occurs.
    Last edited by tacomancer; 05-25-11 at 08:37 PM.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    it's 2 years since the party in power produced a budget in the senate

    according to finance chair max baucus, conrad is not likely to come up with one this year either

    Senate Dems' budget in limbo - The Hill's On The Money

    in times like these

    if something isn't done imminently to protect our precious programs they will expire

    bill clinton chimed in today

    shaking paul ryan's hand backstage at the debt forum (see the video), the former prez from the dlc told the embattled budget chair, "i'm glad we won this race in new york but i hope democrats don't use this as an excuse to do nothing"

    "you shouldn't draw the conclusion that the new york race means that nobody can do anything to solve the rising medicare costs, bubba blared to the forum

    sotto voce, to ryan: "give me a call"

    Bill Clinton to Paul Ryan: Give Me a Call

    it appears obamacare didn't quite succeed in sufficiently bending the cost trajectory, eh, bill

    last friday: With narrow majority, Senate Democrats adopt minimalist agenda - The Washington Post

    "try to do next to nothing and have it look good"

    "reid's approach is that doing nothing looks better for them"

    i guess hurryup harry didn't get the memo

    leadership, anyone?
    Last edited by The Prof; 05-25-11 at 09:11 PM.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    today ryan was voted down in hurryup harry's house of hesitation

    5 republicans bolted---snowe, collins, murkowski, scott brown

    and rand paul from the right

    more power to em, of course

    and then obama's budget, the only piece on paper the party has produced in two years, published in february, the one that bizarrely RAISES deficit spending a brazen 20%, was voted DOWN in hurryup harry's handsome haberdashery, NINETY SEVEN to ZERO

    Indeed, the vote on the president’s plan turned into a rout, with neither Republicans nor Democrats voting in favor of taking it up. At one level, the 97-0 vote showed how out-of-date the February requests can seem after so much has changed in the spending debate already this year. But for Democrats, it also proved a convenient way to mask their substantial internal differences over how to proceed,

    Obama himself has also substantially altered his February requests as part of a “new framework” announced last month just prior to House-Senate talks with the administration led by Vice President Joe Biden. The immediate goal is to find the votes needed to expand Treasury’s borrowing authority and avert default this summer, but Biden has also spoken of the package as a “down payment” toward a longer range deficit reduction plan akin to what was proposed last December by the president’s debt commission.
    Senate votes down Paul Ryan budget plan, 57-40 - David Rogers - POLITICO.com

    fyi

  7. #67
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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Vicchio says



    Actually what older Americans did was exactly the opposite. They spent most of their live working hard. They entered into a social contract with not only government but the rest of society as well and they honored their end of that contract. They did just what they were suppose to do and upheld their end of the bargain. They did not trade their votes and nobody can prove that they did not matter how many right wingers pontificate about such nonsense.
    Oh, the poor hard working souls, they did everything right and now we have to honor that! NO, we do not.

    THEY watched SS, Medicare and Medicaide become over bloated, over spent and wiped out. And what do they do now? Don't give a flip the system's dead, they just want "theirs".

    Sorry, it's time to pull the plug on the whole social welfare state.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Oh, the poor hard working souls, they did everything right and now we have to honor that! NO, we do not.

    THEY watched SS, Medicare and Medicaide become over bloated, over spent and wiped out. And what do they do now? Don't give a flip the system's dead, they just want "theirs".

    Sorry, it's time to pull the plug on the whole social welfare state.
    So you basically think government should be run like a mob. That we should lie and cheat and steal from our own citizens, because you seem to hate people.

    Keep in mind, they were paying for everyone. Not everyone uses SS to the same extent, for the same amount of time, etc. I pay taxes on stuff I'll never use probably. I doubt SS will exist by the time I get to that age, but I still pay it.

    And you know what? Happy to do so. Because I am not selfish enough to deny people access to things they need, even if I don't, and I'm not hateful enough to act in spite against my fellow countryman.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    I respectfully disagree. This election provides a snapshot of what happens when the Republican vote is split between 2 candidates. Despite winning, the Democrat got under 50% of the vote. Had there only been the Republican in the race, and no Tea Party candidate, the district would have stayed red.
    While that may be true, the fact remains that a dem scored 48% in a district where a dem should not have scored more than 35%.

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    Re: Democrat scores upset in Medicare-focused House race

    obama took 46.4% of buffalo/erie in november, 08

    liberal candidates alice kryzan and jon powers won 45% in the 08 house race

    jack davis, then a dem, won 48% in 06, losing by 4 to tom reynolds

    davis lost 44 to 56 to reynolds in 04

    in 2000, 1998 and 1996 democrat maurice hinchey won the seat with 62, 62 and 55%, respectively

    New York's 26th congressional district - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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