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Thread: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Lol. Perhaps you have a promising future as a criminal then because the amount of bad guys shot by gun carrying citizens would seem to indicate that you must just be that much better than the average criminal. It's not at all impossible for an average CC'er to be able to put rounds on target in under two seconds from a concealed draw. The fastest I've personally seen was about .9 seconds from concealed draw with the first round COM on the target. That's pretty damn fast. The number of defensive gun uses would seem to indicate that the average gun carrier is not as helpless as you seem to be implying.



    You can naysay and reinterpret all you wish, but it doesn't change the fact that until my rights actually infringe upon yours, there is no reason to restrict them. Anything else is just emotionalizing what you accurately called a simple "tool." Unless you intend to harm law abiding citizens, why do you care if they are armed?
    We don't shoot criminals very often. In fact, we shoot ourselves much more often. So, I'm not sure what you're going on about.

    And no, I don't believe any rights are being infringed, just as they haven't been infringed all these years.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    We don't shoot criminals very often. In fact, we shoot ourselves much more often. So, I'm not sure what you're going on about.

    And no, I don't believe any rights are being infringed, just as they haven't been infringed all these years.

    Your evidence regarding defensive shootings was already refuted very early on by Goshin, yet you're still riding that tired horse because it's just about all you have.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    Your evidence regarding defensive shootings was already refuted very early on by Goshin, yet you're still riding that tired horse because it's just about all you have.
    No it hasn't. The actual numbers are the actual numbers. They have not been shown inaccurate in any way. Sorry.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No it hasn't. The actual numbers are the actual numbers. They have not been shown inaccurate in any way. Sorry.
    You're absolutely right, you can't argue with the numbers. Last time they were posted, you just chose to ignore them.



    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Estimates on self-defense useage ranges from extreme lows of around 80,000 to extreme highs of 2.5 million, annually. If the truth is somewhere in the middle, guns protect people dozens if not hundreds of times more often than they are used to inflict unintentional or needless or unlawful harm.


    Liberty and fundamental rights FTW.


    Now, please...tell me about ALL those accidental shootings again.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    You're absolutely right, you can't argue with the numbers. Last time they were posted, you just chose to ignore them.

    I've ignored nothing. I addressed them. I showed the error in your use of them. Go back and read.



    Now, please...tell me about ALL those accidental shootings again.
    The numbers are posted. Go back and read.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    I see this as a blessing and not a curse. I would think (IMO) that these guys who decide to go on a gun rampage at colleges are little weak punks who never try this if they thought they would get shot. When you don't know who is packing, you are less likely to pull a gun. And most likely these guns will be tucked away in back packs.
    One Tin Soldier Walked Away..................

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by shintao View Post
    I see this as a blessing and not a curse. I would think (IMO) that these guys who decide to go on a gun rampage at colleges are little weak punks who never try this if they thought they would get shot. When you don't know who is packing, you are less likely to pull a gun. And most likely these guns will be tucked away in back packs.
    I don't beleive that to be true. Most these folks exepcrted to die. Sought being killed. They would, in a crazy way, merely plan better.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I've ignored nothing. I addressed them. I showed the error in your use of them. Go back and read.


    The numbers are posted. Go back and read.

    I read your "numbers." Tell me exactly what kind of mathmetical formula you're using to say that 16,000 alleged accidental shootings is more than 80,000 alleged defensive uses?

    Since you're either forgetful or just playing at ignorance, let me refresh you on how the conversation went.

    You threw out your VPC accidental shooting numbers. (16,000, rounded up)

    Goshin provided his evidence showing that there are far more defensive uses than accidental shootings (80,000, rounded down) and you responded with:

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    What is true is debatable. At least you see the problem with statistics. But adding accidental shootings, not just those that led to deaths, with suicides, and I believe they do out number actual crminals shot (not questionable not shot statistics).
    Now, that's not exactly earth shattering in and of itself, (I'd almost venture to call it a copout) and you never bothered to provided any evidence supporting that when I called you on it several posts later. You even failed to recognize that your "16,000 accidental shootings" number already included non-fatal shootings. You just kept clamoring on about how college "kids" can't be trusted to have good judgement.

    Face it, you have an irrational and unjustifiable fear of armed citizens and will trump up whatever charges you feel necessary to attempt to prove your point. Every time a gun thread crops up, you shout the same unsubstantiated claims and then refuse to acknowledge when the evidence does not back up what you say. It's quite tiresome actually and your dead horse is starting to look a little bruised.

    There's nothing wrong with being proven wrong, the problem lies in the people who stubbornly cling to their point of view after being clearly shown the error in their arguments. Something to think about, Boo.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    [QUOTE=theangryamerican;1059498281]
    I read your "numbers." Tell me exactly what kind of mathmetical formula you're using to say that 16,000 alleged accidental shootings is more than 80,000 alleged defensive uses?

    Since you're either forgetful or just playing at ignorance, let me refresh you on how the conversation went.

    You threw out your VPC accidental shooting numbers. (16,000, rounded up)

    Goshin provided his evidence showing that there are far more defensive uses than accidental shootings (80,000, rounded down) and you responded with:
    Noticed the word alleged. That means we don't have aany real numbers. We have a highly dubious claim that you want to treat as equal to actual numbers.

    Now, that's not exactly earth shattering in and of itself, (I'd almost venture to call it a copout) and you never bothered to provided any evidence supporting that when I called you on it several posts later. You even failed to recognize that your "16,000 accidental shootings" number already included non-fatal shootings. You just kept clamoring on about how college "kids" can't be trusted to have good judgement.

    Face it, you have an irrational and unjustifiable fear of armed citizens and will trump up whatever charges you feel necessary to attempt to prove your point. Every time a gun thread crops up, you shout the same unsubstantiated claims and then refuse to acknowledge when the evidence does not back up what you say. It's quite tiresome actually and your dead horse is starting to look a little bruised.

    There's nothing wrong with being proven wrong, the problem lies in the people who stubbornly cling to their point of view after being clearly shown the error in their arguments. Something to think about, Boo.
    Now read both for unerstanding. When i get back, if you need help, I'll try and help you.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Noticed the word alleged. That means we don't have aany real numbers. We have a highly dubious claim that you want to treat as equal to actual numbers.



    Now read both for unerstanding. When i get back, if you need help, I'll try and help you.
    Your attempts to talk down to other posters don't make your arguments more convincing. Notice that I used the word "alleged" for BOTH your numbers and Goshin's. Those were my words, not his, so please don't cherry pick. If Goshin's low ball estimate was "dubious" than your numbers are just as suspect. Now, since you seem to have trouble with numbers, let's try a picture instead:



    You told Ikari that Colorado was not enough evidence for you to make an accurate judgement about the issue (again, kind of smells of cop out, don't you think?) Wouldn't it be reasonable to say that with over half of the states in the country allowing guns on campuses in some form or another, your wild fears should have played out already?

    Face it, Boo. Guns on campus is not anything new or outrageous. It's not something that they only try in "backwater states" like Texas and Colorado. In fact, it would appear to be a non-issue if you're not a criminal. If someone wants to be able to carry, there is no proven reason to forbid them to do so.
    Last edited by theangryamerican; 05-19-11 at 02:14 PM.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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