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Thread: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    No, they're probably business majors.
    This too. Maybe theater majors as well.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    As I understand law enforcemnt, the likelihood would be that more would have died at VT if more were armed. I'm sure we could find information on this view if we looked. What do you think, should we explore it?


    I think your logic is severely flawed.

    Over 7,000 people came to worship here Sunday and the unthinkable happened. A heavily armed maniac with guns and explosives attacked people as they left the church. Four people were wounded when an alert female, armed civilian volunteer security guard quickly returned fire killing the gunman before more victims could be shot. Two of the wounded victims died later.

    With thousands of potential victims in a seemingly soft target of this church the amount of lives saved is staggering. Thankfully this church was not operating with a Gun Free Zone mentality, as they made sure their parishioners were protected.
    CRIME, GUNS, AND VIDEOTAPE: Heavily Armed Gunman’s Assault Stopped Cold AT The New Life Evangelical Church In Colorado Springs

    Vice Principal Joel Myrick held his Colt .45 point blank to the high school boy's head. Last week, he told me what it was like. "I said 'why are you shooting my kids?' He said it was because nobody liked him and everything seemed hopeless," Myrick said. "Then I asked him his name. He said 'you know me, Mr. Myrick. Remember? I gave you a discount on your pizza delivery last week."

    The shooter was Luke Woodham. On that day in 1997, Woodham slit his mother's throat then grabbed a .30-30 lever action deer rifle. He packed the pockets of his trench coat with ammo and headed off to Pearl High School, in Pearl, Miss.

    The moment Myrick heard shots, he ran to his truck. He unlocked the door, removed his gun from its case, removed a round of bullets from another case, loaded the gun and went looking for the killer. "I've always kept a gun in the truck just in case something like this ever happened," said Myrick, who has since become Principal of Corinth High School, Corinth, Miss.

    Woodham knew cops would arrive before too long, so he was all business, no play. No talk of Jesus, just shooting and reloading, shooting and reloading. He shot until he heard sirens, and then ran to his car. His plan, authorities subsequently learned, was to drive to nearby Pearl Junior High School and shoot more kids before police could show up.

    But Myrick foiled that plan. He saw the killer fleeing the campus and positioned himself to point a gun at the windshield. Woodham, seeing the gun pointed at his head, crashed the car. Myrick approached the killer and confronted him. "Here was this monster killing kids in my school, and the minute I put a gun to his head he was a kid again," Myrick said.

    True humanitarian
    I've been intrigued by Myrick ever since that day. Most have never heard his name, because the mainstream press barely reported how the massacre was stopped. I've become more interested in Myrick's story with every subsequent mass murder. If only someone like Myrick had been at Columbine, I've pondered.
    A principal and his gun Wayne Laugesen Joel Myrick Pearl Mississippi Columbine High School Luke Woodham gun control

    Two of the three Virginia law students who overpowered a gunman in a fatal school shooting were armed and used their weapons to disarm the shooter. Yet of the 280 stories written about the shooting, a mere four mentioned the fact that the heroic students were armed and used their guns to halt the rampage.

    That's according to Dr. John Lott, a resident scholar at American Enterprise Institute and the author of the widely acclaimed book "More Guns, Less Crime."

    Writing in Friday's edition of the New York Post, Lott reported on last week's shooting at Appalachian School of Law. Nigerian student Peter Odighizuwa is accused of killing the dean, L. Anthony Sutin, 42 – a former acting assistant U.S. attorney general and campaign worker for Bill Clinton – professor Thomas Blackwell, 41, and student Angela Denise Dales, 33.

    Noting that the rampage was widely covered in the world's media, Lott wrote: "As usual, there were calls for more gun control.

    "Yet in this age of 'gun-free school zones,' the vast majority of the news reports ignored the fact that the attack was stopped by two students who had guns in their cars. The quick response by two of the students, Mikael Gross, 34, and Tracy Bridges, 25, undoubtedly saved multiple lives," Lott reported.
    Media Ignore Fact That Gun Owners Stopped School Shooter
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    You can do it any way you want. As I recall last time you produced no data, no statistics to back up your point. So if you want to go that route again, you're more than free to do so. However, I am on a campus which allows guns, I am in a town which allows open carry, I am in a state which has the Castle doctrine. And I can say for a matter of fact that college students (adults mind you) carrying weapons on my campus has produced no adverse effects over the decades it's been allowed.
    How do you get statisitics? You do realize we must first have this ocme to past before we can get statisitics, right? You're as bright as anyone I've read on these forms, but you must understand this. So as we have nothing that is exactly like this, we can only look at what we do have stats on.

    Now, we do have and they have been presented stats showing that young people have a greater tendency to make mistakes. Ar eoften mor ecareless. Make poor decisions. We also have law enforement making their cases for why it is a bad idea. We can agree or disagree, but they are making a case. Statistic do show that people as as likely to shoot themselves as anyone else with a gun. And while more people die of car accidents (a meaningless statistics), more people drive and there is greater need for transportation.

    As for adult, 21 year olds are considered adults. I believe information was presented that showed the brain didn't fully develp until the late 20's. So, one can be an "adult" and still be immature and with a brain not fully developed.

    And your campus is not a large enough sample. Frankly, Colorado as a state will be nothing like Florida, or New York or California. Larger cities and population areas are actually quite different than rural areas.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    It's much better to have this right?
    Sure, sure... the right to heavy drinking and shooting.

    Nothing like a loaded deadly weapon in the hands of someone with no inhibitions...

    The football games are going to be a hoot. Especially the post-game parking lot...

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    You can do it any way you want. As I recall last time you produced no data, no statistics to back up your point. So if you want to go that route again, you're more than free to do so. However, I am on a campus which allows guns, I am in a town which allows open carry, I am in a state which has the Castle doctrine. And I can say for a matter of fact that college students (adults mind you) carrying weapons on my campus has produced no adverse effects over the decades it's been allowed.
    But very few of the students take advantage of this, wouldn't you agree.

    But on another note, the axiom "guns don't kill people, people kill people" is very true. If a teacher had a gun available to him or her would the massacre at Columbine had happened? Who knows?

    Had the students had guns at Virginia Tech, would the deaths been minimized?

    Had the man who had a gun at the Gabrielle Giffords shooting actually used his weapon, what would have happened. Well, he was getting ready to shoot someone other than the madman.

    I like having my guns, and I like shooting them as well. I'm trained and I know how to use my weapon in the event I need to draw it, but that is because many of my relatives, including my brother, are ex-military or on the police force, and they required that I get trained if I was going to hang out with them. But I cannot say that about everyone else who owns a gun and decides to carry it, and that's the aspect that concerns me. I would hate to legislate it, but I would love to see those folks that have guns to have the kind of training I had, instead of a gun safety glass through the NRA. I know some Cops that agree...
    "Action expresses priorities."
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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by hazlnut View Post
    Sure, sure... the right to heavy drinking and shooting.

    Nothing like a loaded deadly weapon in the hands of someone with no inhibitions...

    The football games are going to be a hoot. Especially the post-game parking lot...
    Not all college students live their lives in a constant state of inebriation. So do you support denying adults the right to drink or bring alcohol on campus? Adults have the right to bear arms, and as a college student I would feel much safer with my peers being armed versus being unarmed and subject to maniacs that freely violate gun bans and have the intent of mass murder.
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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    I doubt it will save many lives. The real world outcome of this isn't going to be much of anything. We allow concealed weapons on my campus, it's pretty much a non-factor. I'm willing to let anyone who wants to the ability to protect themselves, including carrying guns. But end of the day, not many students are going to do so; and if there were another mass shooting like Virginia or something, well you gotta to have one of those students with a gun in the proximity of the criminal and the fortitude to draw and fire before being taken out. Can it happen? Sure, but it's just not going to be highly likely. You're not really going to promote nor prevent school shootings. They're already relatively rare events and you'd need a right place at the right time sort of scenario for a student to stop one.

    The individual level, sure you'd probably have some better defense if people choose to exercise their rights. But you just don't see many students doing so.
    It's always a non-factor until it is a factor, eh?
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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms


    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Could you link something not from so biased a source. I want to confirm the accuracy of the stories.
    I was at New Life Church with family the day Jeanne Assam used a legally owned, concealed handgun to stop Matthew Murray. The only thing that story does not mention was that Murray shot himself after being hit several times by Assam. Her bullet was not the fatal shot, but without her and her handgun in the way, Murray would have had no one between him and the main sanctuary of the church.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Texas Senate approves guns in college classrooms

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    I was at New Life Church with family the day Jeanne Assam used a legally owned, concealed handgun to stop Matthew Murray. The only thing that story does not mention was that Murray shot himself after being hit several times by Assam. Her bullet was not the fatal shot, but without her and her handgun in the way, Murray would have had no one between him and the main sanctuary of the church.
    Let's not forget this either:

    The former security guard . . . ex-Minneapolis police officer.


    Now, as I talk to law enforement folks, it's risky for some trained well. Maddess for the novice shooter. More likely to miss and hit others.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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