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Thread: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

  1. #151
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by Gill View Post
    Yeah Boo, you're right. I did make an assumption, the assumption that a TEACHer's job is to TEACH. Wow, I guess that was a crazy idea now that I think about it. Based on your and other libby's posts, you think a teacher's job is to babysit, collect free healthcare, count the days down to their pension kicks in, and protest when told to by their union bosses.

    One question: How do you excuse the six or more teachers that passed these people on to the next grade knowing they couldn't even read. If they can't read a job application, they sure as hell couldn't read a history or geography book. Yet each teacher passed the problem off to the next one, who then passed them on to the next one, ad nauseum.

    I never said that teachers were the major problem with these kid's life, but they sure as hell are the major reason they can't even read.
    You seem to have this weird notion that teachers are allowed to actually teach and that they are in charge of deciding who gets to move onto the next grade and who is held back. That's completely untrue and it shows that you don't have any clue how things work in our education system.


  2. #152
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Probably because there are public schools with unionized teachers who do just fine. How about... we deal with the actual problems?
    Schools did much better before teachers were unionized... and it's really no surprise.

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    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  3. #153
    Educating the Ignorant
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by Councilman View Post
    Is there an ethnic component to this story?

    It has been reported that the 8th graders of my generation was were equal to college graduates with an Associates degree today. I wish I knew that a long time ago I could have got my Masters degree two years sooner.

    The Welfare system is geared to break up families as a way to keep minorities down. Look at the history and pay attention as you do and it will come to you.
    I wish I had still had a copy of a test for 8th graders from some farm town in the Midwest about 100-years ago. It illustrates how pathetic schools are today. And these kids were often sharing a school room with kids from other grades, and when they said they had a 3-holer out back, it wasn't a pitch-and-putt golf course.

    Way too much money is wasted, teachers and students are coddled, and the federal government should get its ass out of education. If some district wants to teach their kids Ebonics, and the parents think it's wise... well... better to have one or two localities totally ****ed up than the entire nation.

    .
    The Clintons are what happens...
    when you have NO MORAL COMPASS.

  4. #154
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    Schools did much better before teachers were unionized... and it's really no surprise.

    .
    I would love to see proof of this. Largely I hear a lot of claims, but little support for them.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #155
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I would love to see proof of this. Largely I hear a lot of claims, but little support for them.
    How about using the stats that show the U.S. versus other countries regarding math and science scores?

  6. #156
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    How about using the stats that show the U.S. versus other countries regarding math and science scores?
    Which would prove what? What we're talking about is the cause, not the effect. I suggest our problems are larger than teachers and unions. More systemic. Some piss around the fringe, wasting time and effort on things that will make little to no real difference, while ignoring the larger problems.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  7. #157
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Which would prove what? What we're talking about is the cause, not the effect. I suggest our problems are larger than teachers and unions. More systemic. Some piss around the fringe, wasting time and effort on things that will make little to no real difference, while ignoring the larger problems.
    Then why not let us know what these bigger problems are.

    BTW- Do you really believe there is ANY one answer to a problem in a country of 300+ million. So your answer is a bit of a strawman. The question is less is this THE problem or ONE of the problems.

    Try to be a bit less absolutist.

  8. #158
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    Then why not let us know what these bigger problems are.

    BTW- Do you really believe there is ANY one answer to a problem in a country of 300+ million. So your answer is a bit of a strawman. The question is less is this THE problem or ONE of the problems.

    Try to be a bit less absolutist.
    I have many times. Societially we don't believe in education. Students spend most their time trying not to learn, to get out of school. Parents are more concerned with grades than learning overall. Many are uninvolved. Too many. Too many politiicans govern what is doen, like NCLB removeing decisions from those who best know how to tackle problems. Students are required to go to school, and schools are largely required to to house them when not doing so would be better.

    An no, I've watched teachers take the brunt for a long, long time. teachers and unions, and unions really have little effect on teaching and learning at all. Most teachers are competent. As in any profession, a small percentage are superior. And small percentage is inferior. But most are well within competent standards. Attacking a major problem by looking at only one element of the problem is almost always fruitless.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  9. #159
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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by zimmer View Post
    The Report
    http://cbsdetroit.files.wordpress.co...port_final.pdf

    I'll leave the commentary to others, then again... my bet is it's because the teachers aren't paid enough for their fabulous performance.

    It can't get any worse, so why not try something different, radical... like vouchers and ridding the city of unionized teachers?

    .
    Your statement doesn't make sense. If they have fabulous performance, why does it matter what they are paid?

    Wouldn't fabulous performance mean they are teaching and the kids are learning?

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    Re: Report: Nearly Half Of Detroiters Canít Read

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Some piss around the fringe, wasting time and effort on things that will make little to no real difference, while ignoring the larger problems.
    Teachers agree: Bad teachers with tenure too tough to fire - USATODAY.com

    More than half of teachers believe it's too difficult to weed out ineffective teachers who have tenure, and nearly half say they personally know such a teacher, according to a survey released Tuesday evening by the Education Sector, a non-partisan think tank.

    Most teachers think the evaluation process for new teachers should be strengthened, so that weak teachers don't become entrenched. About 70% of teachers in the Education Sector survey said receiving tenure was just a formality that has little to do with teacher quality. Only a quarter said their own most recent evaluation was "useful and effective."

    Teachers are generally observed in class one or two times a year by busy administrators. In many districts, tenured teachers aren't observed annually. Even when they occur, teachers say their evaluations are rarely rigorous.

    A study of Chicago public schools last year found that more than 90% of teachers received one of the top two possible evaluation ratings ó superior or excellent. Hardly any received the bottom two ratings ó satisfactory or unsatisfactory.

    Principals said they thought it was pointless to give critical judgments of tenured teachers. They also said they didn't want to deal with the grievance process that often accompanies poor evaluations, according to the report by the New Teacher Project, a non-profit focused on teacher quality.
    deal with problems, anyone?

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