Page 63 of 146 FirstFirst ... 1353616263646573113 ... LastLast
Results 621 to 630 of 1460

Thread: Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #621
    pirate lover
    liblady's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    St Thomas, VI
    Last Seen
    03-14-16 @ 03:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    16,165
    Blog Entries
    1

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    let me say this......until it's proved, i don't believe what king says. that said, i'm glad osama is dead and i think it despicable that you use this opportunity to tout bush's torture, just as i find it despicable that anyone anyone uses this occasion in a partisan way. **** em all. focus.

    Originally Posted by johnny_rebson:

    These are the same liberals who forgot how Iraq attacked us on 9/11.


  2. #622
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    05-16-15 @ 02:32 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,537

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    wapo, august 29, 2009:

    How a Detainee Became An Asset - washingtonpost.com

    After enduring the CIA's harshest interrogation methods and spending more than a year in the agency's secret prisons, Khalid Sheik Mohammed stood before U.S. intelligence officers in a makeshift lecture hall, leading what they called "terrorist tutorials." In 2005 and 2006, the bearded, pudgy man who calls himself the mastermind of the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks discussed a wide variety of subjects, including Greek philosophy and al-Qaeda dogma. In one instance, he scolded a listener for poor note-taking and his inability to recall details of an earlier lecture. Speaking in English, Mohammed "seemed to relish the opportunity, sometimes for hours on end, to discuss the inner workings of al-Qaeda and the group's plans, ideology and operatives," said one of two sources who described the sessions, speaking on the condition of anonymity because much information about detainee confinement remains classified. "He'd even use a chalkboard at times."

    These scenes provide previously unpublicized details about the transformation of the man known to U.S. officials as KSM from an avowed and truculent enemy of the United States into what the CIA called its "preeminent source" on al-Qaeda. This reversal occurred after Mohammed was subjected to simulated drowning and prolonged sleep deprivation, among other harsh interrogation techniques. "KSM, an accomplished resistor, provided only a few intelligence reports prior to the use of the waterboard, and analysis of that information revealed that much of it was outdated, inaccurate or incomplete," according to newly unclassified portions of a 2004 report by the CIA's then-inspector general released Monday by the Justice Department. The debate over the effectiveness of subjecting detainees to psychological and physical pressure is in some ways irresolvable, because it is impossible to know whether less coercive methods would have achieved the same result. But for defenders of waterboarding, the evidence is clear: Mohammed cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent, only when his spirit was broken in the month after his capture March 1, 2003, as the inspector general's report and other documents released this week indicate.

    One former U.S. official with detailed knowledge of how the interrogations were carried out said Mohammed, like several other detainees, seemed to have decided that it was okay to stop resisting after he had endured a certain amount of pressure. "Once the harsher techniques were used on [detainees], they could be viewed as having done their duty to Islam or their cause, and their religious principles would ask no more of them," said the former official, who requested anonymity because the events are still classified. "After that point, they became compliant. Obviously, there was also an interest in being able to later say, 'I was tortured into cooperating.'" Mohammed described plans to strike targets in Saudi Arabia, East Asia and the United States after the Sept. 11 attacks, including using a network of Pakistanis "to target gas stations, railroad tracks, and the Brooklyn bridge in New York." Cross-referencing material from different detainees, and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the CIA and FBI went on to round up operatives both in the United States and abroad. "Detainees in mid-2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals -- many of who we had never heard of before -- that al-Qaeda deemed suitable for Western operations," according to the CIA summary.

  3. #623
    Sage

    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    05-16-15 @ 02:32 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    12,537

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    yesterday, abc reports: the courier that led us to ubl was one of the individuals first made known to us by ksm in the period after he received eit's, during one of what us intel officers quoted by wapo above called the 9-11 mastermind's "terrorist tutorials"

    this info was uncovered in the time when ksm became langley's "preeminent source on al qaeda," that is, when ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

    ksm, abc advises, first provided langley with the identity, only a nickname

    it was al libi who gave it away that this person, one of many people named by ksm, was a courier who, if he were followed, might lead us to the target

    abc, yesterday:

    Phone Call by Kuwaiti Courier Led to Bin Laden - ABC News

    In a secret CIA prison in Eastern Europe years ago, al-Qaida's No. 3 leader, Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, gave authorities the nicknames of several of bin Laden's couriers, four former U.S. intelligence officials said. Those names were among thousands of leads the CIA was pursuing.

    One man became a particular interest for the agency when another detainee, Abu Faraj al-Libi, told interrogators that when he was promoted to succeed Mohammed as al-Qaida's operational leader he received the word through a courier. Only bin Laden would have given al-Libi that promotion, CIA officials believed.

    If they could find that courier, they'd find bin Laden.

    The revelation that intelligence gleaned from the CIA's so-called black sites helped kill bin Laden was seen as vindication for many intelligence officials who have been repeatedly investigated and criticized for their involvement in a program that involved the harshest interrogation methods in U.S. history.

    "We got beat up for it, but those efforts led to this great day," said Marty Martin, a retired CIA officer who for years led the hunt for bin Laden.

    Mohammed did not reveal the names while being subjected to the simulated drowning technique known as waterboarding, former officials said. He identified them many months later under standard interrogation, they said, leaving it once again up for debate as to whether the harsh technique was a valuable tool or an unnecessarily violent tactic.
    either way, can anyone deny the president's security adviser?

    Said Brennan: "The president had to evaluate the strength of that information, and then made what I believe was one of the most gutsiest calls of any president in recent memory."
    a great day for america!

    the nation is gratefully indebted to all who serve us and made this happen
    Last edited by The Prof; 05-03-11 at 01:09 PM.

  4. #624
    Jedi Master
    Captain America's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Wisconsin
    Last Seen
    Today @ 10:19 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    18,671

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    No traditional American justice is done before a court of law.
    Just saying.
    True. But it's justice enough for me. In fact, it's BETTER than justice. Just sayin'.

    It's GREAT to be me. --- "45% liberal/55% conservative"
    Diplomacy is the art of saying 'nice doggy" until you can find a gun.

  5. #625
    Sage
    mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    DC Metro
    Last Seen
    11-13-16 @ 12:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    22,499

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by AndrewC23 View Post
    I am sober unfortunately and how do you know when the war in Afghanistan is going to end are you the great Nostradamus? Can you predict the future?
    When did I try to do that?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  6. #626
    Sage
    mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    DC Metro
    Last Seen
    11-13-16 @ 12:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    22,499

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    In my military history class a few years ago, my professor invited a CIA case officer (also a former Marine and former student of the same class) to give a guest lecture to the class. He said it was NEVER okay to torture, and that the "ticking time-bomb scenario" (which is a one-in-a million chance contrived scenario in the first place) and for which many envision torture to be useful could be avoided if one had done their homework the right way up until that point.

    To me, torture represents doing things the convenient and easy way, rather than doing things the right way. It is un-American and goes against our values. The ticking time-bomb scenario is the ONLY scenario for which I would even consider saying that torture is justified. And who's to say that the same intelligence couldn't have been obtained without torture, with a little more time and patience?
    I agree, I disagree that waterbaording and sleep deprivation can honestly be catagorized as torture.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  7. #627
    Sage
    mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    DC Metro
    Last Seen
    11-13-16 @ 12:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    22,499

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by liblady View Post
    i had no idea. what have i missed on this story? my daughter got married sunday, so i haven't had time to breathe. did obama have terrorists waterboarded? btw, you're quite rude.
    libgrandlady soon?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  8. #628
    Basketball Nerd
    StillBallin75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    Vilseck, Germany
    Last Seen
    12-10-17 @ 07:52 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Progressive
    Posts
    21,896

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I agree, I disagree that waterbaording and sleep deprivation can honestly be catagorized as torture.
    Waterboarding is definitely torture. I think sleep deprivation is harder to categorize. It may be inhumane, but I don't think it can honestly be categorized as torture. There are many psychological methods and tactics of interrogation that are effective, that don't involve the use of physical torture, that I approve of.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 05-03-11 at 01:49 PM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  9. #629
    Sage
    mac's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    DC Metro
    Last Seen
    11-13-16 @ 12:58 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    22,499

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Waterboarding is definitely torture. I think sleep deprivation is harder to categorize. It may be inhumane, but I don't think it can honestly be categorized as torture. There are many psychological methods and tactics of interrogation that are effective, that don't involve the use of physical torture, that I approve of.
    Waterbaording is a training technique, how can it be torture?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  10. #630
    Banned
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Last Seen
    05-09-11 @ 04:56 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Slightly Conservative
    Posts
    156

    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Maybe he shouldn't have used his real address on the PlayStation Network?

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •