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Thread: Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #281
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    I don't think anyone is kidding themselves into thinking that it is the death of an ideology. As others have said, I think it brings a sense of peace and closure to the families of the victims of 9/11. Frankly, this should have been done long ago, and it's sad that people had to wait 10 years for this to happen. I'm not pointing fingers at Bush for this either. I think that Obama had a tactical advantage and took it. That being said, please don't buy into the poorly constructed stereotypes of Americans and think that they are foolishly celebrating an end to terrorism or whatever, that clearly isn't the case.
    Just so people know, this operation was YEARS in the making, and the intelligence community was very patient and deliberate in planning this. They, and those SEAL boys deserves a hell of a lot of credit for pulling this off. Again I've said this before but I'm not keen on giving Obama too much credit for this one. He did what he was supposed to do.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  2. #282
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    I don't think anyone is kidding themselves into thinking that it is the death of an ideology. As others have said, I think it brings a sense of peace and closure to the families of the victims of 9/11. Frankly, this should have been done long ago, and it's sad that people had to wait 10 years for this to happen. I'm not pointing fingers at Bush for this either. I think that Obama had a tactical advantage and took it. That being said, please don't buy into the poorly constructed stereotypes of Americans and think that they are foolishly celebrating an end to terrorism or whatever, that clearly isn't the case.
    What this does show are a few things from the United States:
    1. Tenacity - once the American's get on your trail, they don't let off, even after 10 years
    2. Consistancy - Whether it's a Democrat or Republican, or Independent - they'll still sign orders to kill terrorists when we find them.
    3. Ability - We can enter a country of 180 Million covertly, strike a terrorist target successfully within 35 miles of their capital and get out with utter secrecy.

    All the little Osama fans are having a bad day. It's natural they'll strike out and be mad.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  3. #283
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    DD...are you ****in serious??

    1) I don't see how ANYONE benefits from a "nation-building agenda"
    2) Birthers have no evidence to back up their positions, yet you've been calling them out as racist. Your position on Bush and 9/11 is equally without merit.
    That is absolutely not true...there is ample evidence that Cheney/Rumsfield went to GWB and told him that 911 was the perfect tool to justify an invasion of Iraq...and in the days/weeks after 911, they convinced GWB to advance their plan...a plan that even HWB refused to pursue.
    <font size=5><b>Its been several weeks since the Vegas shooting.  Its it still "Too Early" or can we start having the conversation about finally doing something about these mass shootings???​</b></font>

  4. #284
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    Hey Noob, you can't come here to DP, claim qualifications and experiences that, frankly, we have no way of verifying and then expect instant respect.
    Can we verify the claims of those who have been here longer any better? People make all sorts of claims about themselves here, and pulling this "Noob" business in order to invalidate one claim vs. any other has no merit.
    "you're better off on Stormfront discussing how evil brown men are taking innocent white flowers." Infinite Chaos

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    That is absolutely not true...there is ample evidence that Cheney/Rumsfield went to GWB and told him that 911 was the perfect tool to justify an invasion of Iraq...and in the days/weeks after 911, they convinced GWB to advance their plan...a plan that even HWB refused to pursue.
    Dude - take it somewhere else please. You're hangup with "Bush Lied People Died" for Iraq is not the subject here.
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


  6. #286
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    That is absolutely not true...there is ample evidence that Cheney/Rumsfield went to GWB and told him that 911 was the perfect tool to justify an invasion of Iraq...and in the days/weeks after 911, they convinced GWB to advance their plan...a plan that even HWB refused to pursue.
    Okay, I apologize. I had thought you meant the Bush admin. had an active hand in 9/11. But honestly Iraq is not what this thread is about, and GWB cannot be faulted for not finding Osama during his term (at least he can't be faulted for lack of trying).
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 05-02-11 at 10:48 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  7. #287
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    This is my first response since the announcement of his death and surprisingly, I'm not feeling what everyone else seems to be.

    I don't feel joy, happiness, relief, or like this is an occasion to celebrate, and I'm not really sure why. What I do know is he shouldn't have been able to escape justice for 10 years after the 9/11 attacks, and in that sense I feel like he was the winner, not us. Kind of like "too little, too late." The other thing is, no matter what the man did, something inside of me can't find joy in the death of anyone. I would have much rather seen him captured so he would have to face up to what he did, even though I realize the nightmare that would have caused...

    Anyway, I just had to get that out.

  8. #288
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Moderator's Warning:
    Osama Bin Laden is deadMembers are advised to read and comply with the opening message in this thread.

    http://www.debatepolitics.com/breaki...post1059454231

  9. #289
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Grim17 View Post
    This is my first response since the announcement of his death and surprisingly, I'm not feeling what everyone else seems to be.

    I don't feel joy, happiness, relief, or like this is an occasion to celebrate, and I'm not really sure why. What I do know is he shouldn't have been able to escape justice for 10 years after the 9/11 attacks, and in that sense I feel like he was the winner, not us. Kind of like "too little, too late." The other thing is, no matter what the man did, something inside of me can't find joy in the death of anyone. I would have much rather seen him captured so he would have to face up to what he did, even though I realize the nightmare that would have caused...

    Anyway, I just had to get that out.
    I'm wondering what makes you say that, Grim.

    He's dead, we're still here.

    The US, as messed up as our country is at this point, is still here. The Islamic Caliphate is not.
    Last edited by StillBallin75; 05-02-11 at 10:53 AM.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  10. #290
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Just so people know, this operation was YEARS in the making, and the intelligence community was very patient and deliberate in planning this. They, and those SEAL boys deserves a hell of a lot of credit for pulling this off. Again I've said this before but I'm not keen on giving Obama too much credit for this one. He did what he was supposed to do.
    Of course it was years in the making, but Obama deserves credit for refocusing the effort on Afghanistan and Pakistan. He made a promise in 2008 that they would get bin Laden and he kept it. He went forward with the Afghan surge when many people in his own party were against. He did what he was supposed to do - that's the point.

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