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Thread: Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #1431
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    i included nothing, the ig report speaks for itself
    Well, you quoted from a newspaper article, and not the IG report. but w/e.

    I think you did good.
    I may be wrong.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Simon W. Moon View Post
    Well, you quoted from a newspaper article, and not the IG report. but w/e.

    I think you did good.
    However, in context, his claim is that we got the OBL intel not only after "his spirit was broken," but that this means the EITs got us that information. This has not been supported by either the IG report, or anything else I'm aware of.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    anything else you're aware of---LOL!

    which means the news hasn't yet appeared on whitehouse.gov

    or in sydney, australia

    "waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

    after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

    ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

    the 9-11 mastermind conducted "terrorist tutorials"

    "detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

    "cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

    "ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

    thanks!

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Prof, none of that speaks to the intel recieved concerning OBL, which we're told was gathered long after the EITs. If they had in any role, we would have gotten it sooner. You have to willing suspend disbelief to buy that they played a major role in that intel.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    "after the eit's"

    yup, that would be in the period when ksm was conducting "terrorist tutorials"

    when he was langley's "preeminent source on aq"

    when ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

    that's when the cia went on "to build a list of 70 individuals, many of whom we had never heard of"

    our heroic agents then went on to "cross reference material from different detainees and leverage information from one to extract more detail from another"

    this is what allowed "the cia and fbi to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

    "ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

    oh, yeah, one more thing: "waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I have no desire to waste my time with your silliness
    LOL!

    say hi to sydney

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Yes, Prof, I did let you draw me in. But you don't ever really answer my questions. That makes you a waste of time and effort.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    from the ig report released by eric holder's doj on the monday preceding aug 29, 2009:

    "waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

    after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

    ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

    the 9-11 mastermind conducted "terrorist tutorials"

    "detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

    "cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

    "ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

    thanks!

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Just one more time, that DOES NOT SAY ANYTHING ABOUT THE INTEL CONCERNING OBL. So, it is meaningless in answering me.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Just one more time
    LOL!

    the preeminent source on aq has nothing to do with intel concerning ubl---that's NOT what eric holder said

    america is grateful president barack the slasher hussein FAILED so comprehensively in his ridiculously wrong minded attempts to undo the anti terror policies of his predecessors, thus allowing our agents and heroic seals to accomplish this historic assassination

    USA!

  10. #1440
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Oh please. If you had read what is being said, it wasn't the EIT's that were the yield of intel, but after their spirit to resist was broken then more traditional methods could be used.
    That is what Cheney and the rest of the righties are trying to push, but it has been refuted. Waterboarding did not yield the info that Cheney and Thiessen both claim.

    The first report, dated July 13, 2004, is titled "Khalid Sheikh Mohammed: Preeminent Source on al-Qaida." The second report, dated June 3, 2005, is titled "Detainee Reporting Pivotal for the War Against al-Qaida." As the titles suggest, these reports are not about the effectiveness or ineffectiveness of water-boarding and other techniques employed to elicit information from enemy combatants; they speak only to the value of the information gleaned from Sheikh Mohammed and other detainees. We know that Sheikh Mohammed and other detainees were water-boarded, but the reports shed no light on what they said before they were water-boarded versus what they said afterward.
    To the extent that the two reports explore detainees' reasons for revealing valued information, it is to demonstrate not how difficult it was to elicit but how easy. Sheikh Mohammed, we learn, "appears to have calculated, incorrectly, that we had this information [about al-Qaida's attempts to acquire biological and chemical weapons] already." What a chump! Also, "almost immediately following his capture in March 2003," Sheikh Mohammed "elaborated on his plan to crash commercial airplanes into Heathrow Airport." This was probably because he knew a key plotter was already in custody. But he "withheld details about the evolution of the operation until confronted with"—a cat-o'-nine-tails?—no (yawn), just "reporting from two other operatives knowledgeable concerning the plot." Sheikh Mohammed dropped a dime on Iyman Faris, a truck driver from Ohio with whom Sheikh Mohammed had plotted to destroy the Brooklyn Bridge by cutting its cables with acetylene torches. Sheikh Mohammed, we learn, gave Faris up "[s]oon after his arrest." Far from a tough nut, the Sheikh Mohammed who emerges from these reports sounds like a regular Chatty Cathy.
    Abu Zubaydah (whose importance within al-Qaida later became a matter of some dispute) identified Sheikh Mohammed as 9/11's mastermind "early in his detention," which, a March 29 Washington Post story reported, citing unnamed CIA officials, was before Zubaydah was water-boarded. After Zubaydah was water-boarded, the Post said, "Zubaida's revelations triggered a series of alerts and sent hundreds of CIA and FBI investigators scurrying in pursuit of phantoms." Every lead "ultimately dissolved into smoke and shadow, according to high-ranking former U.S. officials with access to classified reports."

    Cheney's CIA memos don't show what he said they'd show. - By Timothy Noah - Slate Magazine

    BTW, do you know of a method that is 100% reliable in intel gathering? I don't. And I spent 6 years in the Army including the 101st.
    The CIA can obtain valuable information with just using regular methods, other than "torture".



    Interrogation Experts From Every Branch of the Military and Intelligence Agree: Torture DOESN’T Produce Useful Information | The Big Picture



    All intel has to be verified.
    Not sure what that has to do with the fact that a speech writer doesn't know what the CIA does when it comes to information gathering.



    "I have been thinking that I would make a proposition to my Republican friends... that if they will stop telling lies about the Democrats, we will stop telling the truth about them."
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