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Thread: Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #1271
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    From your link:


    "According to an October 21, 2001, Washington Post article, President Bush in September of last year signed an intelligence "finding" instructing the CIA to engage in "lethal covert operations" to destroy Osama bin Laden and his al Qaeda organization.

    White House and CIA lawyers believe that the intelligence "finding" is constitutional because the ban on political assassination does not apply to wartime. They also contend that the prohibition does not preclude the United States taking action against terrorists."



    Also Clinton, reagan, dropped bombs on quadaffi, and afghan guerilla camps, Assasination attempts.

    They too, held up on charges?
    You would consider dropping bombs on a compound as equal to shooting an unarmed man? You make leaps I'm not willing to make.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Erod View Post
    Wisconsin and Governor Walker. The tornadoes in the South. The Arizona Congresswoman shooting. California's bankruptcy. Obamacare repeal. Arizona's sovereignty to enforce immigation law. The earthquake in New Zealand. Libya. Egypt. Tunisia. Syria. Yemen.

    Things blow by so quickly.
    Last I heard of Representative Giffords, she was doing OK. She was at the Endeavour's aborted launch a few weeks ago. Her husband is the mission commander.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I did hear one person was armed, and shooting. That doesn't however mean that OBL wasn't killed in the cross fire.
    you don't know what went down in that compound in abbottabad on sunday?

    LOL!

    that's astonishing

    Still, my answer is clear, no I don't support assassination.
    few care what people who don't even know what happened do or don't support

  4. #1274
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You would consider dropping bombs on a compound as equal to shooting an unarmed man? You make leaps I'm not willing to make.


    yes, as one who has done just that, I can tell you, sometimes, you are dropping bombs on a lot of unarmed folks.


    they targeted the leaders, the fact that one is a couple 5.56, and the other a couple 500lb jdams, really makes it different for you?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Neither does your opinion.
    J, I have never said any of the things you quote. Do try to address what I say.






    Fixed a couple of things for you in the interest of your much requested honesty.
    See above. Being dishonest in your "fixing" isn't what I asked for.


    Nope, you're right, he is just keeping in place all of Bush's policies regarding these things.
    Again, be honest. Not being able to change it is not equal to keepig in place. He did deounce and stop use of torture. He has tried to close Gitmo. These are facts.


    Well, that's your opinion, which you know what that means in real terms? Squat! Just because someone disagrees with your POV, doesn't mean that they have unsound reasoning, or that they are restricting themselves to an echo chamber of one sided ideas, that is more projection on your part I think. But, as it were, this would be no fun if we all agreed all the time would it? The difference is that when that disagreement comes you seem to feel the need to personally attack. That is what I see as the huge flaw in your reasoning Joe.
    I don't expect agreement j. As I noted, there is a difference between logical disagreement and utter garbage.

    What law was broken? Please cite it, as well as what a possible prosecution would be in the event that it is even true that any law was broken.
    See above. If it is not politcal, it wouldn't be an assassination. That would make it murder.

    Wait, you make a case just one quote up about the 'rule of law' arguing that you think it possible that Obama did break the law, now you hedge and say 'IF'.... I think this is the tactic that exposes your own dishonesty when debating. Ambiguity is less than genuine in these matters.

    j-mac
    J, notice the words think and possible. They are consistent with if. Not being sure where you're not 100% sure is not dishonest. It would be dishonest to pretend there is no other possibility.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    yes, as one who has done just that, I can tell you, sometimes, you are dropping bombs on a lot of unarmed folks.


    they targeted the leaders, the fact that one is a couple 5.56, and the other a couple 500lb jdams, really makes it different for you?
    Yes, it does. When dropping bombs on a target, often with fire coming back at you, it is part of war. Once you have a man, and you shoot him, that becomes something very different. That's plain ass murder.

    Now, you can bomb places that cross the line. Dresden comes to mind. Civilian populations with no military objective would cause pause. Even our dropping the atomic bombs were questionable decisions that could be rightly questioned. But even they would not be the same as just shooting an unarmed man.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, it does. When dropping bombs on a target, often with fire coming back at you, it is part of war. Once you have a man, and you shoot him, that becomes something very different. That's plain ass murder.
    so Obama is a murderer? yes or no.


    Now, you can bomb places that cross the line. Dresden comes to mind. Civilian populations with no military objective would cause pause. Even our dropping the atomic bombs were questionable decisions that could be rightly questioned. But even they would not be the same as just shooting an unarmed man.
    What if we bombed the compound in pakistan, that would not be "murder" like the assassination to you was?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Yes, it does. When dropping bombs on a target, often with fire coming back at you, it is part of war. Once you have a man, and you shoot him, that becomes something very different. That's plain ass murder.

    Now, you can bomb places that cross the line. Dresden comes to mind. Civilian populations with no military objective would cause pause. Even our dropping the atomic bombs were questionable decisions that could be rightly questioned. But even they would not be the same as just shooting an unarmed man.
    I just got on this thread Boo, but it seems you are suggesting that the SEALs murdered OBL.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
    - Colonel Paul Yingling

  9. #1279
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I just got on this thread Boo, but it seems you are suggesting that the SEALs murdered OBL.


    He is. And Obama too.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  10. #1280
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I just got on this thread Boo, but it seems you are suggesting that the SEALs murdered OBL.
    If there is a crime, it is not them I would prosecute. They acted under orders. I'm saying that assassination is illegal. Assassination by definition is killing political leaders. If the SEALS just decided on their own to kill someone, unarmed, they would face charges. Under orders, as I suspect here, I would blame the order giver.

    That said, just as with Bush, I don't believe either will ever face charges. I believe Bush broke the law, and have not argued for impecahment or prosecution. Only agree he broke the law and I would be fine if he were chraged. He won't be. The same is true of Obama.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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