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Thread: Osama Bin Laden is dead

  1. #991
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    If it was stopped in 2006...and eit was possibly responsible for UBL's take down....then GWB is entirely to blame, right?
    No, he would be a criminal. when the courts rule you can't do, and you lie to the courts and congress saying it has stopped, that's criminal as far as I know.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    My answer to your question is pointless because I know exactly where you are going with it.
    So, avoid it rather than face it honestly. There's courage.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    So, avoid it rather than face it honestly. There's courage.
    You really want to turn this into a pissing contest? My answer has nothing to do with lacking courage. It's because it's pointless because your comparison is invalid. Clearly this discussion with you is pointless as well. Have fun with yourself.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No, he would be a criminal. when the courts rule you can't do, and you lie to the courts and congress saying it has stopped, that's criminal as far as I know.
    The courts said what exactly?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Dr_Patrick View Post
    You really want to turn this into a pissing contest? My answer has nothing to do with lacking courage. It's because it's pointless because your comparison is invalid. Clearly this discussion with you is pointless as well. Have fun with yourself.
    lol, later.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    No, actually this comparison is what is absurd.
    Not really. Being tortured and being raped both result in psychological trauma that could affect the victim for the rest of their lives. Skydiving is an activity done by choice, and for fun, comparing it to waterboarding is ridiculous. You can't seriously believe what you're saying. Nobody would believe it.
    A working class hero is something to be

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    No, what it does is make you feel like you are drowning without in anyway drowning you.
    Not entirely true. You can swollow water and for all intents and purpose drown, just not die if they do it correctly.

    However, our agreements and past disucssions not only recognize mental distress as torture, but has included water boarding in the definition. it saddens me that we are actually ahving this discussion today as if history doesn't exist at all.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not entirely true. You can swollow water and for all intents and purpose drown, just not die if they do it correctly.
    you don't drown from swallowing water....

    However, our agreements and past disucssions not only recognize mental distress as torture, but has included water boarding in the definition. it saddens me that we are actually ahving this discussion today as if history doesn't exist at all.
    appeal to emotion, try again boo.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    Quote Originally Posted by Mustachio View Post
    Not really. Being tortured and being raped both result in psychological trauma that could affect the victim for the rest of their lives. Skydiving is an activity done by choice, and for fun, comparing it to waterboarding is ridiculous. You can't seriously believe what you're saying. Nobody would believe it.
    I've done both and can compare them. They are similar in the feelings they create (of course, I have a minor fear of heights)
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

  10. #1000
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    Re: Osama Bin Laden is dead

    today: Administration Grows Frustrated As Conversation Shifts From Bin Laden To Waterboarding

    Officials inside the Obama administration have grown discouraged by the abruptness with which the news over the killing of Osama bin Laden has turned into a debate over the efficacy of harsh interrogation techniques and torture.

    Just days after the al Qaeda leader was killed in a compound in Abbottabad, Pakistan, the political conversation has shifted from the implications of the assassination to questions of whether the waterboarding of valuable detainees was crucial in gathering intelligence on bin Laden's whereabouts.

    Defenders of the interrogation technique raised the issue, earning write-ups in several high-profile publications, including The New York Times and Time magazine. It was also put forward in most bin Laden-related news interviews with Obama officials. The problem, those officials stress, is that questioning the effectiveness of waterboarding in the bin Laden case oversimplifies a complex issue to which there may not be any concrete answers.

    "There is no possible way to know for sure," said one senior Obama administration official. "Even if waterboarding did produce something -- and that is debatable, the timeline seems very unclear -- it is impossible to say whether interrogation absent it would have produced the same thing. It might have. Lots of detainees provided [intelligence]."

    White House spokesman Tommy Vietor was more directly dismissive. "I think this is a distraction from the broader picture, which is that this achievement was the result of years of painstaking work by our intelligence community that drew from multiple sources," he said. "It's impossible to know whether information obtained by EITs could have been obtained by other forms of interrogation."
    bob graham of florida, former senate intel chair, and carl levin of minnesota, current boss at armed services, go on in huffpo's account to dismiss the role of eit's

    but i think graham's conclusion is fair:

    Graham argues the key ingredient to finding bin Laden may not have been, necessarily, the interrogation methods used on detainees but rather how U.S. personnel were able to use the information they received.
    congratulations to the white house for leaving in place most of the anti terror tactics instituted by his predecessor, detention, gitmo, warrantless wiretapping of phone calls made to couriers...

    america is grateful

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