Page 5 of 7 FirstFirst ... 34567 LastLast
Results 41 to 50 of 67

Thread: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

  1. #41
    Professor
    other's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    VA
    Last Seen
    01-22-14 @ 11:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,473

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    The pastor's actions are not justifiable... that's like justifying the behavior the Westboro Church.
    who the hell said the pastor's actions were justifiable? Notice I said that any action against the pastor now might justify the murderer's actions (in his own, or other radicals', eyes).

    The pastor is not guilty of murder, the pastor is guilty of baiting insane, murderous people to murder.
    What law did the pastor break?

    He was warned by the Pentagon and by the terrorists themselves... ignorance is not an excuse. He did what he did, and he didn't give a **** about the safety of the troops or anybody else.
    Yeah, he's a piece of ****, but there's no law against that.
    Last edited by other; 04-28-11 at 05:43 PM.

  2. #42
    Sage
    Ikari's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Colorado
    Last Seen
    12-08-17 @ 01:05 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Left
    Posts
    54,124

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    1. You Godwinned yourself.
    2. You are arguing that we are incapable of altering people's behaviour and altering environments that cause behaviour, which has been demonstrated by social scientists be a flawed notion.
    1) Damned it!
    2) I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that people make up their own minds and choose their own actions. The Pastor did not MAKE those men over there kill Americans. First off, we're fighting a war so that put the Americans there in the first place. Second off, we're fighting a hostile ideology which puts us at odds with many of the people over there. Third off, the fringe group of these hostile people are insane. Fourth...off? he burned a Koran, he did not hold a gun to the people's head to make them murder, he did not endorse the murder in the least, he did not pay for them to murder someone, in short he did not directly make them do anything.

    The people at fault are the people who pull the trigger. Their brains sent the signal to their hands to pull the trigger. The Pastor cannot affect that. This was not an immediate reaction like yelling fire in a crowded theater. These people had time to think and plan about what they were doing. They are, therefore, completely accountable for the actions being taken. I'm not going to curtail our rights here because of some dumbass terrorists half the world away. That's how they win. They can all go choke on bacon for all I care.
    Last edited by Ikari; 04-28-11 at 06:48 PM.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  3. #43
    Sage
    SheWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    24,508

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by other View Post
    who the hell said the pastor's actions were justifiable? Notice I said that any action against the pastor now might justify the murderer's actions (in his own, or other radicals', eyes).



    What law did the pastor break?



    Yeah, he's a piece of ****, but there's no law against that.
    I am not mistaken that there is a law against it, however, I am claiming he is entirely innocent either

  4. #44
    Professor
    other's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    VA
    Last Seen
    01-22-14 @ 11:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,473

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    I am not mistaken that there is a law against it, however, I am claiming he is entirely innocent either
    I can't quite make out what you're saying here...

  5. #45
    Professor
    ElCid's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    08-14-11 @ 04:39 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Very Conservative
    Posts
    1,784
    Blog Entries
    3

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by repeter View Post
    Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans
    A different version of this story was posted, but I want to post this for some information it provides, that I hadn't heard before.
    This part made my blood boil. Pastor Jones has American blood on his hands. Now, I don't want to give any more attention to that d**k, but the point I want to drive home is that his speech directly caused the death of 2 American servicemen.
    Fighting for Muslims is a fundamentally BAD idea, regardless of circumstances.

  6. #46
    Sage
    SheWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    24,508

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    1) Damned it!
    2) I'm not arguing that. I'm arguing that people make up their own minds and choose their own actions.
    People don't make choices independent of influence.

    This pastor was influence to burn the Quran because of his view of Islam and people in the Middle East.

    The people who murdered men and women in the ME, were influenced by the pastor burning the Quran and said so.



    The Pastor did not MAKE those men over there kill Americans.
    The pastor did not make them... He did not force them to kill anybody.

    The pastor was not forced or made to burn the Quran either.

    Everybody is accountant for their own action...

    First off, we're fighting a war so that put the Americans there in the first place.
    And I am arguing that each event is caused by a preceding even (causality), not free will. You seem to be going back forth... it's free will, it's causality.

    We were attacked on 9/11, so now we are fighting a war. A lot of people in America have intolerant views of Islam, because we were attacked by them on 9/11 (causation)... Some people here even hate Islam and think it's just a hate filled religion, therefore they are caused to hate Islam in return (causation).

    This event influenced the pastor to burn the Quran... and because of the chain of events and causation in the ME, many people there hate America.

    Honestly, the results of this pastor's actions were not unpredictable. We have seen this play out before in Denmark over cartoons and Draw Muhammad Day.

    The people who murdered the men in women did not make that choice free of influence, or suddenly feel like killing people for no reason. This was not a random killing. Likewise the pastor did not make his choice free of influence... that's all I am saying. This is not innocent people, acting freely on free will and doing **** randomly without cause. The pastor cannot honestly be that ignorant. The pastor knew who would be pissed off, and he had a reason to burn the Quran.

    Second off, we're fighting a hostile ideology which puts us at odds with many of the people over there. Third off, the fringe group of these hostile people are insane. Fourth...off? he burned a Koran, he did not hold a gun to the people's head to make them murder, he did not endorse the murder in the least, he did not pay for them to murder someone, in short he did not directly make them do anything.
    And nobody held a gun to his head and forced him to burn the Quran... Nobody was forced in this situation to do anything. Each party is accountable for their role in the sequence of events.

    The people at fault are the people who pull the trigger. Their brains sent the signal to their hands to pull the trigger.
    I never said anybody else pulled the trigger.

    The Pastor cannot affect that.
    The pastor can affect this, had he not burned a Quran. He was warned by the Pentagon... He was warned by the murderers and terrorists themselves. He had the ability to decide not set a Quran on fire, as much as the murderers had the ability to not pay him any attention and to not kill people.

    If he has any grasp of human interaction, he would know his actions would incite anger not handshaking and parades.

    This was not an immediate reaction like yelling fire in a crowded theater. These people had time to think and plan about what they were doing. They are, therefore, completely accountable for the actions being taken. I'm not going to curtail our rights here because of some dumbass terrorists half the world away. That's how they win. They can all go choke on bacon for all I care.
    They have won... They can take this story and say, "hey look, America does hate us... Hey look, they burn our holy book, they hate Islam. Defend Islam."

    I never said he was responsible for pulling the trigger...

  7. #47
    Sage
    SheWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    24,508

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by other View Post
    I can't quite make out what you're saying here...
    There is no law against him... but he is still accountable for playing into the terrorists and inciting them

  8. #48
    Professor
    other's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    VA
    Last Seen
    01-22-14 @ 11:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,473

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    There is no law against him... but he is still accountable for playing into the terrorists and inciting them
    Thanks for clarifying.

    That's what you've been saying all along... so I'll reiterate one of my earlier points:

    What about the media? If you hold the pastor accountable for inciting the murder, shouldn't the news stations that made the story international -- effectively supplying it to the terrorists-- also be held to the same standard? You can't argue that the issue of some nobody preacher burning a book in some swamp was a pressing issue that needed international attention during a time of war. They, like the preacher himself, were aware of the implications... so, while the preacher did the deed, the media made damn sure everyone, including that afghani ****bag, knew about it.

    If the pastor would've refrained from burning the book, the murderer couldn't point at him and say "he made me do it."

    Likewise, If the pastor would have simply been ignored, as he deserves, the murderer couldn't point at him and say "he made me do it."
    Last edited by other; 04-28-11 at 08:58 PM.

  9. #49
    Sage
    SheWolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    24,508

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by other View Post
    Thanks for clarifying.

    That's what you've been saying all along... so I'll reiterate one of my earlier points:

    What about the media? If you hold the pastor accountable for inciting the murder, shouldn't the news stations that made the story international -- effectively supplying it to the terrorists-- also be held to the same standard? You can't argue that the issue of some nobody preacher burning a book in some swamp was a pressing issue that needed international attention during a time of war. They, like the preacher himself, were aware of the implications... so, while the preacher did the deed, the media made damn sure everyone, including that afghani ****bag, knew about it.

    If the pastor would've refrained from burning the book, the murderer couldn't point at him and say "he made me do it."

    Likewise, If the pastor would have simply been ignored, as he deserves, the murderer couldn't point at him and say "he made me do it."
    Like I said above... there is a large chain of events playing role in this outcome... The media is one of them... This man was caused desire to burn the Quran as a result of influences in the chain of events, and his actions have a reaction. There are a lot of things playing a role in the chain of events. The media is always responsible for their reporting on both ends... making the pastor feel justified in hating Islam, and broadcasting his actions to an anti American and angry sect of Muslims.

  10. #50
    Professor
    other's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    VA
    Last Seen
    01-22-14 @ 11:01 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,473

    Re: Afghan officer opens fire, kills 9 Americans

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    Like I said above... there is a large chain of events playing role in this outcome... The media is one of them... This man was caused desire to burn the Quran as a result of influences in the chain of events, and his actions have a reaction. There are a lot of things playing a role in the chain of events. The media is always responsible for their reporting on both ends... making the pastor feel justified in hating Islam, and broadcasting his actions to an anti American and angry sect of Muslims.
    So what do you think should happen to this preacher and the media concerning their supposed accountability in the murders in Afganistan?

Page 5 of 7 FirstFirst ... 34567 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •