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Guantánamo leaks lift lid on world's most controversial prison

Ron Mars said:
I already have and so has Prof.

I don't care if you refuse to accept the truth.

_
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No, showing people making the claim is nto what anyone is asking for. :coffeepap
 
but it's not holder's claim, silly

it's the ag's CONCLUSION

"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

thanks for the opportunity to repeat the ig's summary endorsed by doj

it's very helpful
 
The Prof said:
but it's not holder's claim, silly

it's the ag's CONCLUSION

"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

thanks for the opportunity to repeat the ig's summary endorsed by doj

it's very helpful
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You know, we did show you misread the IG. That said, anything given, stated, and not support with clear verifiable examples is nothing more than a claim.
 
what's to misread, silly?

words have meanings, remember?

LOL!

"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

those are GOOD words

thanks, president slasher for NOT dismantling the anti terror techniques put in place by previous administrations, thus enabling our diligent agents and heroic seals to realize this assassination

USA!
 
THERE IS NO PROOF OF THESE TACTICS WORKING. How clear do I have to make myself? Robert Mueller says they didn't work, but your quotes say they do work. We can go back and fourth posting claims from different officials of "it works" or " it doesn't work"

There is no direct evidence of these tactics working and that's the end of this. That's it. End of story. Counter me on that please.

Prisoners of war are released after the war ends. This is a different situation. We are talking about people that cannot simply be "released". We can't detain people indefinitely. It doesn't work that way. They need to see military tribunals (which are the same thing as a court case pretty much) and be sentenced to an American jail as terrorists. That's it. End of story.
 
Gargantuan said:
THERE IS NO PROOF OF THESE TACTICS WORKING. How clear do I have to make myself? Robert Mueller says they didn't work, but your quotes say they do work. We can go back and fourth posting claims from different officials of "it works" or " it doesn't work"

There is no direct evidence of these tactics working and that's the end of this. That's it. End of story. Counter me on that please.

Prisoners of war are released after the war ends. This is a different situation. We are talking about people that cannot simply be "released". We can't detain people indefinitely. It doesn't work that way. They need to see military tribunals (which are the same thing as a court case pretty much) and be sentenced to an American jail as terrorists. That's it. End of story.
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Like I said. He isn't serious and rarely thinks this through. :coffeepap
 
"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

ig report, released by eric holder's doj, monday preceding aug 29, 2009
 
The Prof said:
"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

ig report, released by eric holder's doj, monday preceding aug 29, 2009
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Again, those are just claims. Show us some information we actual got. :coffeepap
 
The Prof said:
drinking in detroit again?

LOL!
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This is your way of admititng that you can't provide that information. Of course we all know that by now. :coffeepap
 
Gargantuan said:
Debate over
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yup

"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

the 9-11 mastermind conducted "terrorist tutorials"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

inspector general's summary, released by doj, monday preceding aug 29, 2009

america is grateful barack the slasher hussein did NOT dismantle the anti terror tactics of dick cheney thus allowing this assassination to go down

we're all fortunate the slasher comprehensively FAILED to push thru HIS security priorities

USA!
 
Barack the slasher hussein obama (never heard this one before) did dismantle the anti terror tactics of Dick Cheney. Waterboarding and EITs are no longer utilized. Using special operations is not a policy of the Bush Administration. They did not invent special ops.

Who are these operatives, what is this list, and what was deciphered? Also, prove to me that it was EITs specificially that got KSM to give that information up.
 
Gargantuan said:
Prisoners of war are released after the war ends.
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So you agree - not everyone deserves to see a trial.

We are talking about people that cannot simply be "released". We can't detain people indefinitely.
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You contradict yourself here.

We can't detain people indefinitely. It doesn't work that way.
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Sure it does. If WW2 was still going on, every surviving German/Jap POW would still be in capativity - and not one of them would have had a trial.

They need to see military tribunals
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The boy who was captured by US troops while engaged in combat doesn't.
He was captured in combat. There's nothing to put hom on trial for.
That's it - end of story.
 
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PzKfW IVe said:
So you agree - not everyone deserves to see a trial.


You contradict yourself here.


Sure it does. If WW2 was still going on, every surviving German/Jap POW would still be in capativity - and not one of them would have had a trial.


The boy who was captured by US troops while engaged in combat doesn't.
He was captured in combat. There's nothing to put hom on trial for.
That's it - end of story.
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You're not understanding what I mean. Of course you can't put them on trial for anything in the case of someone fighting a war against us. Fighting a war is an honorable thing for one's nation. In this case, we are dealing with a stateless enemy. They are terrorists plain and simple. You deal with a stateless terrorist the same way you'd deal with any other terrorist (alla McVeigh) and put them on trial then send them to a supermax facility.
 
Senate Votes 90 to 6 To Block Funds For Guantanamo Closure

Obama, in Europe, signs Patriot Act extension - US news - Security - msnbc.com

Obama Administration Continues Indefinite Detention Policy For Prisoners | American Civil Liberties Union

Gargantuan said:
Who are these operatives, what is this list, and what was deciphered?
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holder's ig didn't say

all he told us was:

"waterboarding and sleep deprivation were the two most powerful techniques and elicited a lot of information"

after a month of brutal eit's in a secret prison in europe ksm "cooperated, and to an extraordinary extent"

ksm "transformed" into langley's "preeminent source on aq"

the 9-11 mastermind conducted "terrorist tutorials"

"detainees in mid 2003 helped us build a list of 70 individuals---many of whom we had never heard of"

"cross referencing material from different detainees and leveraging information from one to extract more detail from another, the cia and fbi went on to round up operatives both in the us and abroad"

"ksm was an unparalleled source in deciphering aq's strategic doctrine, key operatives and likely targets"

i wonder why holder's ig didn't offer more

LOL!
 
Gargantuan said:
You're not understanding what I mean.
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You seem to be pretty clear - Everyone desreves a trial.

Of course you can't put them on trial for anything in the case of someone fighting a war against us.
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So.... not everyone deserves a trial? You aren't being clear.

In this case, we are dealing with a stateless enemy. They are terrorists plain and simple.
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The boy is held because he was captured in combat against US forces. Plain and simple.
There's nothing to put him on trial for.
That's it - end of story.

You deal with a stateless terrorist the same way you'd deal with any other terrorist (alla McVeigh) and put them on trial then send them to a supermax facility.
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MVeigh was executed.
 
Gargantuan said:
You deal with a stateless terrorist the same way you'd deal with any other terrorist (alla [sic] McVeigh) and put them on trial then send them to a supermax facility.
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LOL!

what america are you living in?

certainly not barack the slasher hussein's
 
Right, but where was McVeigh held before his execution? Not some offshore facility was he?

Don't twist my words into attempting to make me look stupid. You know damn well I don't mean prisoners of war in a state vs state conflict deserve a trial. What the hell are you supposed to try them for?

So then "the boy" will be tried for attacking US forces. He can be tried by a military tribunal and eventually jailed in a supermax facility, just like McVeigh any other terrorist would be. What about the fort hood shooter? He killed members of US forces (I know not all 13 were, but a good chunk were US military personnel) Does that mean he should be sent to Gitmo? Is he a POW because he killed soldiers? NO! He is not a soldier of any nation.
 
Gargantuan said:
Right, but where was McVeigh held before his execution? Not some offshore facility was he?
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Irrelevant to anything you have said so far.

Don't twist my words into attempting to make me look stupid. You know damn well I don't mean prisoners of war in a state vs state conflict deserve a trial.
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YOU said "everyone".

What the hell are you supposed to try them for?
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Seems to me I made this point.
The kid captured in combat was captured in combat. Nothing to put him on trial for.

So then "the boy" will be tried for attacking US forces.
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The kid captured in combat was captured in combat. Nothing to put him on trial for.

He can be tried by a military tribunal and eventually jailed in a supermax facility, just like McVeigh any other terrorist would be.
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No German captured in combat was put on trial. No Jap captured in combat was put on trial. Nothing to put them on trial for.
And... as noted... McVeigh was executed.
 
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