• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

IMF bombshell: Age of America nears end

I saw this and read it and the first thought that came to mind is....THANK YOU CORPORATE AMERICA for taking a country with 2billion people that ate dog and cat and creating the worlds greatest economic power and soon to be super power all at the expense of fellow americans out of GREED.
Anyone that tries to deny that our corporations did this out of greed is lieing to themselves
 
lpast said:
I saw this and read it and the first thought that came to mind is....THANK YOU CORPORATE AMERICA for taking a country with 2billion people that ate dog and cat and creating the worlds greatest economic power and soon to be super power all at the expense of fellow americans out of GREED.
Anyone that tries to deny that our corporations did this out of greed is lieing to themselves
Click to expand...

It's rare that I defend corporations, lpast, but what exactly does greed have to do with this?
 
lpast said:
I saw this and read it and the first thought that came to mind is....THANK YOU CORPORATE AMERICA for taking a country with 2billion people that ate dog and cat and creating the worlds greatest economic power and soon to be super power all at the expense of fellow americans out of GREED.
Anyone that tries to deny that our corporations did this out of greed is lieing to themselves
Click to expand...

I don't view the world as a zero-sum game. In other words, prosperity in the U.S. and China need not be mutually exclusive propositions. Technology, transportation, trade, etc., have made it possible for the underdeveloped/developing world to make meaningful progress in terms of economic development. That does not mean "game over" for the U.S. The choices present and future U.S. leaders will make will shape the American destiny. Attempts to preserve the status quo/avoid sacrifice, even as the nation faces major challenges and the world around it continues to change, could lead to a bad outcome. The courage and willingness to make the necessary sacrifices/take the necessary risks to overcome major challenges, as well as the foresight to make wise investments (education, key infrastructure, dealing with key factor challenges, etc.) to continue to push the frontiers of knowledge/technology, could lead to a bright outcome. Past generations have seen the U.S. take the latter course, but the wider lens of history has seen nations sometimes take the former one.

Another pivotal moment is approaching. The choices today's and tomorrow's leaders make will determine whether the U.S. will embark an a path of renewal or whether it will suffer the kind of erosion in its strategic flexibility that raises the risk of decline.
 
Harry Guerrilla said:
That doesn't necessarily mean anything.
Having more people doesn't equate to having a more productive economy.
Click to expand...

Yes, it does and Pete is right

The Chinese population outnumbers us what 5:1 - 6:1?? Their undocumented, i.e. unreported births, population is 300,000,000. That is equal to the entire US population. They could trade us casnualties one for one until there wasn't an American left, and it would bring their population down to their official level

Let me put this way...Lets say... a million people starve to death in China because of a glitch in their economy, do you think they (the leaders) will really care when their population is 1,306,313,812 or whatever the *official number* is at the moment?
 
PeteEU said:
As are your comments since you cant even think logically. Your partisan chest thumping Nationalism has blinded you to the truth. Population DOES matter when you talk TOTAL GDP which is what we are. So suck up and admit you are wrong.

As for "vast natural resources" comment just shows how little you actually know. You do know that China imports a lot of natural resources right? China's "natural resources" have been exploited for 5000+ years, where as the American resources have only for 200 years. Who do you think has more now? Not my fault or that of China's that you dont have the political will or technical ability to exploit your own resources safely and economically.
Click to expand...

This is what you said,

PeteEU said:
This is a stupid discussion. Of COURSE China will pass the US.. India will too!.. they have 3x+ the amount of people living there for peak sake!
Click to expand...

To which I respond, that it is immaterial because even if they had 100 million people, if there economy produces more, has more direct foreign investment, they could still pass beyond us, regardless of their population.

They have tons of natural resources.
 
We have plenty of people in this country. We don't even employ all the people that are able. We have too many strap-hangers that are not pursuing happiness, and too few people that understand how this country should be operating. We have a Constitution that is the envy of the world, and a republican government that has lasted longer than any other. This country has done more, prospered more, had more people at a better living standard in 300 years than any other country in history. The system works, as long as we adhere to the fundamental rules and principles.
 
StillBallin75 said:
What China regards itself as is irrelevant. The reality is that it is.
Click to expand...

China isn't proving that communism works, they're proving that our system works. The only thing that China has not accomplished in a modern sense, is being original. They do a damn good job at stealing, copying and plagiarizing. What they need now is to develop a culture of being original, like American have done.
 
American said:
China isn't proving that communism works, they're proving that our system works. The only thing that China has not accomplished in a modern sense, is being original. They do a damn good job at stealing, copying and plagiarizing. What they need now is to develop a culture of being original, like American have done.
Click to expand...

In terms of economics, I'm inclined to agree with you.

In terms of culture? Chinese culture was around long before American culture. Just sayin'
 
American said:
We have plenty of people in this country. We don't even employ all the people that are able. We have too many strap-hangers that are not pursuing happiness, and too few people that understand how this country should be operating. We have a Constitution that is the envy of the world, and a republican government that has lasted longer than any other. This country has done more, prospered more, had more people at a better living standard in 300 years than any other country in history. The system works, as long as we adhere to the fundamental rules and principles.
Click to expand...

True, but looking at history, nations start out young, small and energetic. They either expand and conquer the nations around them through military conquest, immigration and assimilation, or merger, or suffer that same fate. As a nation ages, it eventually slows. It may grow rich and bloated, or slow and weak. Eventually, a younger, stronger nation will succeed in supplanting it.

At some point, a government consider's it's survival and power to be of greater importance than that of its citizen's or subjects

Enter China. China is old, but the People's Republic of China is not. Today, China is full of proof that the lives of their citizens are not important to the government and when they decide to tackle the US, the economic disruption and deaths will be considered acceptable, a cost of doing business.

Make no mistake, the Chinese gov is evil, cold and heartless
 
StillBallin75 said:
What China regards itself as is irrelevant. The reality is that it is.
Click to expand...

China and the US are both dependent on the integrated global economy, of which they are both amongst the most influential. Saying one is dependent on the other is simply not true.
 
Khayembii Communique said:
China and the US are both dependent on the integrated global economy, of which they are both amongst the most influential. Saying one is dependent on the other is simply not true.
Click to expand...

I don't see how these two ideas are mutually exclusive. They're the two biggest players in the global economy. To say that they AREN'T dependent on each other to some extent would be disingenous.
 
I don't see how these two ideas are mutually exclusive. They're the two biggest players in the global economy. To say that they AREN'T dependent on each other to some extent would be disingenous.
Click to expand...

Well sure, they're dependent on each other as well as every other country on earth.
 
PeteEU said:
Yes
Click to expand...

No.

Not that.

Not the completely inane empty Negation Response!

Oh, and how exactly is the US going to get its cheap goods then?
Click to expand...

Hint: LESS is more. The United States does not need plastic toys in Happy Meals, nor does it need Beanie Babies, Webkinz, or despot laden oil. It doesn't need welfare programs. "He that will not work shall not eat" must once again become our motto. Death to tyrants, and Don't tread on me!

Americans need to rediscover who the hell they are. They're the greatest! They're Americans! They've allowed their neighbors to steal their freedom as well as their money. They've allowed morons in a bureaucracy tell them they can't drill their own damn oil becuase some stupid caribou would get warm or some mosquitoes won't get laid.

The United States has the resources. We've got the oil. Our liberals are so stupid they wet their pants everytime anyone mentions poking a hole in the seabed to get it. We've got the best universities on the planet, they'll be even better when the liberals are kicked out and the schools start teaching reality again. What America puts it's mind to, it does, once it cleans the dead bugs off the windshield.

That what America needs, friggin' vision. Tired old whiny socialists in the government are the reason the US is faltering, and the whiny socialists demand we get more socialism.

What the US needs is a return to freedom, a Restoration of Innovation, a return to the time when a man kept what he earned, and what he didn't earn he didn't get. When America does that, the world is once again our road and we're driving the steam roller.

That's the vision America needs.
 
StillBallin75 said:
I don't see how these two ideas are mutually exclusive. They're the two biggest players in the global economy. To say that they AREN'T dependent on each other to some extent would be disingenous.
Click to expand...

that depends entirely on whether you see the world in mutually beneficial or zero-sum terms. Never underestimate China's nationalism - which replaced communism as the ideology of legitimacy. There are plenty of people in that leadership who would be happy to "lose less" than America and end up "on top".
 
cpwill said:
that depends entirely on whether you see the world in mutually beneficial or zero-sum terms. Never underestimate China's nationalism - which replaced communism as the ideology of legitimacy. There are plenty of people in that leadership who would be happy to "lose less" than America and end up "on top".
Click to expand...

My opinion? zero-sum makes no sense (unless you are some sort of extreme nationalist). Not if you look at the big picture.
 
Last edited:
ric27 said:
Not really...Great cultures rise and fall about every 400 years like clockwork. Read up....We're due.
Click to expand...

We didn't become the worlds largest economy until 1890 and didn't become a superpower until 1945. So aren't we due sometime between the year 2290-2345?
 
Erod said:
IMF bombshell: Age of America nears end Brett Arends' ROI - MarketWatch



There are big issues with this theory, no doubt. Most people in China live in abject poverty, and the divide between the haves and have-nots there is massive. The Chinese people in general aren't thinking much about taking over the planet; they're trying to eat.

The ugly truth for China is that they are still completely dependent on the U.S. And in the end, he with the biggest bombs will forever rule the day. Some things never change.
Click to expand...

America has often been counted out.

It was the same song during the first Carter Administration, now that we have the second and more inept Carter Administration, we have bigger problems.

All we need is to elect responsible adults who will simply turn off the government spigot, reduce the burdens placed by government on the people and hand back responsibility to the states. Embrace individual rights... liberty. You know... follow The Constitution... that document 74% of high school students believe is the name of the next NFL expansion team.

.
 
Last edited:
Ocean City said:
We didn't become the worlds largest economy until 1890 and didn't become a superpower until 1945. So aren't we due sometime between the year 2290-2345?
Click to expand...

Read up on history.....READ not browse over it

Historically speaking, America has had its shot. Civilizations tend to rise and fall about every 400 years. Columbus arrived here in 1492, so we're about due. I mentioned Columbus, which is interesting considering where Spain ended up 500 years later: ....Geopolitically irrelevant aka piss poor

Now, lets get to the meat and potatoes....

In the first place, democracy is doomed when the gen pop (you're included) figures out it can vote itself resources out of the national treasury. Allowing people whose only stake in the system is how much money they can extract from government programs to vote is one of our grandest ****ups. There's no feel good way to address that, therefore will be willfully ignored.

You can also thank FDR's new deal, Johnson's great society, the counter culture of the 60's, the democratic congress of the Reagan era who quietly worked to structure the tax laws in such a way that more than half of our pop receives wealth distribution in the guise of tax "credits", the bigots who advocate "diversity" over "assimilation", thank single issue voters who would vote for Mister dumbass himself if he professed to be on the thier side of the (you pick) abortion, gun control, or health care issue, and most of all....oh, and thank every freaking liberal you've ever met who wishes our society was more "progressive" and quietly works to make it so.

Obama's socialism will be the precipitating event that's likely to cause failure of our system, but there are plenty of other factors at work too. The increasingly bull**** litigious nature of our society is contributing to the problem by spinning a web of ****ed up rules and policies that are absurdly unworkable for the common John Doe.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom