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Thread: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

  1. #291
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    yes, but our poor are fatt-er, and it's not a little because the least expensive foods are also the worst for you.
    That food is not really "least expensive".

    It is, actually, "heavily subsidized and under-regulated". The beef and corn (starch, syrup, etc) suck tax dollars and poison both the people and the land. All told, a burger, fries and soda might be the most expensive meal around.


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    Last edited by ecofarm; 04-28-11 at 01:40 PM.

  2. #292
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by iamitter View Post
    You've got to be joking. When part of your income is taken away from you, of course private spending is affected.
    Not 100% true.

    It has an impact on lower and middle classes; it has basically no impact on the highest income brackets.

    Compare a hedge fund manager who makes $1 Billion a year to 20,000 families who make $50,000 a year.

    Is the hedge fund manager going to buy 20,000 homes? 20,000 people's worth of clothing and food? No.

    You can change his tax rate from the current 17% (because it's capital gains, not income) to the 28% that the average families make and he's going to spend basically the exact same amount he was going to spend anyway.

    However, if you dropped the tax rate on the 20,000 families making $50,000 a year from 28% to 17% - you WOULD see a stimulative effect on the economy.

    This is why the Bush tax cuts did little to grow the economy. They were mis-targeted.

    Seriously - if you walked up to me and gave me $20,000, I guarantee you it would be spent (most of it anyway). If you walked up to Nicole Kidman and gave her $20,000 you've done nothing to alter her lifestyle in the least. She might spend it, but it just means that another $20,000 will sit in her account unspent - thus creating no stimulative effect.

  3. #293
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by FilmFestGuy View Post
    Not 100% true.

    It has an impact on lower and middle classes; it has basically no impact on the highest income brackets.

    Compare a hedge fund manager who makes $1 Billion a year to 20,000 families who make $50,000 a year.

    Is the hedge fund manager going to buy 20,000 homes? 20,000 people's worth of clothing and food? No.

    You can change his tax rate from the current 17% (because it's capital gains, not income) to the 28% that the average families make and he's going to spend basically the exact same amount he was going to spend anyway.

    However, if you dropped the tax rate on the 20,000 families making $50,000 a year from 28% to 17% - you WOULD see a stimulative effect on the economy.

    This is why the Bush tax cuts did little to grow the economy. They were mis-targeted.

    Seriously - if you walked up to me and gave me $20,000, I guarantee you it would be spent (most of it anyway). If you walked up to Nicole Kidman and gave her $20,000 you've done nothing to alter her lifestyle in the least. She might spend it, but it just means that another $20,000 will sit in her account unspent - thus creating no stimulative effect.
    People mistake where brackets actually are, though. Top 10% in the US starts at 80k. There's a handful of people who it won't affect.

    In any case, people with tons of money do not just leave that money lying around. It is invested and enters the economy in other ways. Consumption is not the only factor in our economy.
    Give a man a fish, or he will destroy the only existing vial of antidote.

  4. #294
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    it explains why she thinks healthcare is somehow "different". the logic there too is foppery - you can make the same argument about food and housing. but that's the "pragmatic" portion of the argument

    and then she went on to deal with the "yes but it's unconstitutional" portion of the argument by saying it was okay because Congress had the right to regulate mental activity. I quoted for you the relevant portion of the ruling where she explicitly utilizes that exact logic.

    your inability to answer it remains telling.
    It is different. You can choose not to own a car, for example. You cannot choose not to receive health care, especially in an emergency.

    And CP, you not acknowledging the answer is not equal to you not being answered. That silly tactic wears thin as well.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  5. #295
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    There are but two sides to the ledger and both must be dealt with. We do need more revenue. We do need spending cuts.
    Typical right wing plot. Spending cuts mean cutting more jobs, less buying all around, more foreclosures... Exactly what the Reps need to kill the economy, and discredit Obama.

    Most people can't relate with money in the billions, but they can relate with how many jobs it will it cost.

    ricksfolly

  6. #296
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    pretty big doings the last 2 days

    Mitch McConnell: Vote on Obama budget - Meredith Shiner - POLITICO.com

    yesterday: harry announces he'll put ryan on his floor, make republicans vote for it

    today: mcconnell will force a vote on OBAMA'S BUDGET, published in february

    y'know, the one that increases borrowing 20% to 1.65T while simultaneously punting, characteristically, on entitlements

    the one the slasher TOOK BACK a couple days after ryan put out his plan

    jon summers, reid spokesman: mcconnell's pulling "a stunt"

    cuz "the president has already revised his budget proposal"

    oh

    it's been SEVEN HUNDRED DAYS since the united states senate has WRITTEN DOWN a budget

    at a time in our history when bold action is most required

    ie, IN TIMES LIKE THESE

    where do you go to get back your self respect?

    leadership, anyone?

  7. #297
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    It is different. You can choose not to own a car, for example. You cannot choose not to receive health care, especially in an emergency.

    And CP, you not acknowledging the answer is not equal to you not being answered. That silly tactic wears thin as well.
    as does your dancing around the issue.

    but perhaps you could answer the question simply: Does the Congress have the right to regulate mental activity? Irrespective of this ruling, Obamacare, or any other issue - does Congress have the right to regulate our mental activity?

  8. #298
    Teacher of All Things


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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Steel View Post
    We don't have a spending problem.


  9. #299
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    pretty big doings the last 2 days

    Mitch McConnell: Vote on Obama budget - Meredith Shiner - POLITICO.com

    yesterday: harry announces he'll put ryan on his floor, make republicans vote for it

    today: mcconnell will force a vote on OBAMA'S BUDGET, published in february
    IMO, this political tit-for-tat is to be expected given the looming 2012 campaign. Unfortunately, even as they are to be expected, these tactics suggest that the nation's political leaders continue to have difficulty prioritizing their work. IMO, the single highest priority in the weeks ahead after Congress returns on Monday should be to develop an acceptable framework for raising the debt ceiling and setting forth a credible fiscal consolidation path on a timely basis.

    Instead, hours of debate will be wasted on needless political theater. Such theater, even as it will almost surely invoke deficits and debt, has little to do with the larger and more urgent priorities that should be the immediate focus of the Senate's attention. It will accomplish nothing in the pursuit of fiscal consolidation. It will consume time that could have been devoted to develoing a credible fiscal consolidation strategy.

  10. #300
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    Re: Poll shows Americans oppose entitlement cuts to deal with debt problem

    hr1 is not a tit, it's a budget

    ryan's plan is not a tat, it's hard numbers

    barack the slasher's "solution," in contrast, is just another great speech, an excellent speech

    it is what it is

    leadership, anyone?

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