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Thread: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

  1. #151
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by ricksfolly View Post
    Americans don't know what they want...
    don't try to run on that

    vote for obama---you don't know what you want

  2. #152
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Are you talking about the huge savings to be made by having the government manage the Advantage Care, rather than the past practice of letting private companies provide it at a much greater cost?

    That is cutting waste, something I thought we were all interested in, except the insurance companies that have been making record profits at our great expense.
    You call cutting 500 billion waste?
    There isn't 500 billion in Medicare that is waste, in the traditional sense.

    They were reducing payments to doctors, which they went back on and which also resulted in the Obamacare bill adding more to the deficit.

    The advantage plans are for gaps in Medicare coverage.
    I was discovering that life just simply isn't fair and bask in the unsung glory of knowing that each obstacle overcome along the way only adds to the satisfaction in the end. Nothing great, after all, was ever accomplished by anyone sulking in his or her misery.
    —Adam Shepard

  3. #153
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by pbrauer View Post
    Americans couldn't cares less about the budget, if they had, they would have screamed bloody murder when Bush was president.
    that was then, this is now

    They DO care about having Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid
    and they're precariously insolvent, americans know they won't be there in a generation

    at the state level, public pensions are in even worse shape

    FT.com / US / Economy & Fed - US public pensions face $2,500bn shortfall

    if the entitlements are such wonderful programs, why are they in such dire need of draconian fix

    why are they killing us

    and that's why President Obama and the Democrats will take this legislation and wrap it around the neck of Republicans.
    no, harry will never be able to put a number on paper

    the slasher, unable to produce, will have to shut up

    he'll be seen as a president in a crisis with no plan to get out except hyper partisanship and class division

    run on that
    Last edited by The Prof; 04-17-11 at 02:34 AM.

  4. #154
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Yes. There are those who realize the Courts are a political body and often write rulings to achieve political ends at odds with the Constititution.

    Plessy v Ferguson was not Constitutional
    Roe v Wade was fiction-based.
    Kelo v New London is clearly based in Mammon, not the Constitution.
    The Miller decision that led to the imposition of gun control laws is clearly based on falsity.
    The decisions that accepted the New Deal scams were political in nature, and almost none of them have any valid constitutional backing, especially not any of the entitlement scams, such as Social Security and the FHA.

    That's the problems lawyers have with the United States Constitution. It was written in English, and Americans can both read it and decide for themselves when the damn courts are pulling **** out of their asses.

    Well thanks for your opinion, I think I will go with 80 years of rule of law that shows that progressive taxes have never been successfully challenged as to whether they are Constitutional.

    There are groups of people that live out in the woods who I understand share that point of view however.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  5. #155
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Tammerlain View Post
    Quite true

    But the last three years are hold a rather significant fact. The final collapse of consumer demand driven by debt in the US. Something that has been building for the last 30 years or so. The US govenment had the choice of a massive deflationary event by providing no government stimulus to the economy. But I doubt any president ( Ron Paul excepted) would have done pretty much the same as Obama has, for the most part Obama has followed the same policies as Bush when it comes to the economy. McCain would have done not much different, a couple hundred billion here or there, which when talking about 1.6 trillion deficits is rather small when it comes to differences in government spending

    Now as Keynesian theory suggests that durin good economic periods running a governmengt surplus is in order to fund government deficits during the bad years, the question would be, why was not surplus run during the bush 2 years and the good years of the reagan admin? Government surplus's certainly can be achieved. Canada, Australia ran them during the early to mid part of Bush 2 years. Meaning the US could have as well
    Because a government "surplus" means the government is stealing money that has not lawful purpose. It's money held by the government, which means it's money that both immorally attached and doing nothing useful. Whereas a a balanced budget implies the government is running so that revenues meet expenditures, and the remaining money in the hands of the people who can best make use of it (that's the people who earned it), a government surplus is money taken that does nothing at all. And you're familiar with the saying that the Devil finds work for idle hands, just imagine what the socialists have managed to do with idle money. Why, the socialists have wasted it, every dime.

    Keynesian theory never works, that's why FDR's Depression got worse, not better, it's why Carter's economy got worse, and it's why Bush's and Obama's "solutions" have failed.

  6. #156
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Harry Guerrilla View Post
    You call cutting 500 billion waste?
    There isn't 500 billion in Medicare that is waste, in the traditional sense.
    Provide a link to your $500 billion cut in benefits claim please then.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

  7. #157
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Mayor Snorkum View Post
    Well, first off, any definition of fair will have to show compliance with existing law.
    Say what? How does existing law define any compliance with the definition of fair? Everyone's definition of fair varies. Is it fair that the rich pay more because they earn more? It is fair that the rich pay more because they own vast majority of assets in this country? It is fair that everyone pays the same amount? The problem with people like Turtle is that they define fair as they please and do not stick to that definition. I have no respect for people who unilaterally change their definitions based on how badly they are losing an argument.

    Taxation in excess of the spending authorized by the Constititon is blatantly illegal, and hence unfair to everyone, even more so for those paying the greatest proportion of the taxes.
    That shouldn't be a problem as the COTUS doesn't cover that. Furthermore, taxation in excess of spending isn't necessarily a bad idea. For instance, states do this all of the time. They deposit the surplus into rainy day funds which generate income which can be used for disaster, stimulus or budget balancing. IMO, building a surplus is far preferable then deficit spending. I'd rather have the fed tax more, build a surplus fund and use that surplus fund for stimulus spending during recessions then borrow money. At least with that method we stay in the black. As Japan shows us, bad stuff happens. Going in to debt to fix that is not preferable when you can build up a safety fund during good times. What I vastly dislike about the Tea Party is that they don't seem to understand this .

    The rich, of course, pay the greatest portion of the taxes.
    The rich also own the greatest portion of asset.

    So, clearly, taxes are already too high.
    That does not logically follow.

    The issue of the budget deficit isn't one of insufficient taxes, it's one of excess and unconstitutional spending.
    Actually it's both.

    Given that almost 50% of the nation isn't paying federal taxes, and it can't be fair that 2% of the people are carrying 50% of the tax burden. No rational definition of fair is going to allow this.
    Come again? 50% don't pay federal taxes? You got this where? Last I checked, payroll taxes are federal taxes. And only around 45% of the country is not working. Actually 10% of the population is carrying 55% of the burden.

    Congressional Budget Office - Data on the Distribution of Federal Taxes and Household Income

    As for no "rational" definition, well that is your opinion.

    Take this for example: The economy is basically a machine to generate material wealth. The economy is kept going by taxes that support the economy and regulate it so that it functions properly. Now, who should pay the majority of taxes in such a system? Those who own very few of the total wealth or those who own the majority of the wealth?

    So much for your "no rational definition of fair is going to allow this."

    Given that raising taxes on the wealthy when the tax system is on the wrong side of the Laffer Curve decreases revenue
    Which is nothing more than speculation.

    Thievery is never fair by any honest appraisal.
    Taxation =/= theft.

    Fairness means spreading the tax burden out to more and more people, so they can understand the issues involved.
    That depends how you look at things. See my earlier example.

    If you keep up the notion that taxation = theft, you are not worth talking you.
    "If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him." - Sun Tzu

  8. #158
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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    All the programs and taxes you hate and loathe were enacted by BOTH parties.
    yes, they were

    fdr's social security and lbj's civil rights and medicare were all passed with significant republican support

    indeed, in 64 it took everett dirkson to break richard russell's and young kkk byrd's filibuster, and civil rights became law with greater gop backing than dem

    obamacare, in crying contrast, was crammed via senate reconciliation which came mere days after the party was prepared to deem the darn thing

    talk about extreme

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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Well thanks for your opinion, I think I will go with 80 years of rule of law that shows that progressive taxes have never been successfully challenged as to whether they are Constitutional.

    There are groups of people that live out in the woods who I understand share that point of view however.
    Then again, since the Mayor has been discussing the unconstitutional spending and not saying word one about the Constitutionality of taxes (having read the Constitution, the Mayor is aware that there were amendments that damaged the Republic before the 17th Amendment killed the Republic.)

    However, since the Fourteenth Amendment requires that no persons be denied equal protection under the law, it is clear that such crass discrimination as the graduated income tax, to use an accurate name instead of it's propagandized image, is a violation of the basic intent of the Fourteenth Amendment, violates the founding ideology expressed in the Declaration of Independence, and is flatly nothing but a juvenile expression of class envy. Not to mention that the wealthy simply do not have the money to finance the orgy the left is demanding. The Wall Street Journal commented the other day that a 100% tax on all people making in excess of $100k would net $1.5 trillion, and yet Obama's budgets are three times greater.

    The issue is not a tax issue, the issue is the spending and the issue about the spending is that almost all of the spending is in direct violation of the Constitution.

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    Re: House passes huge GOP budget cuts

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    Exactly, the sides are clear in the class war that is underway in America.
    another winner bumper sticker

    pick sides, vote for obama, 2012

    leadership, anyone?

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