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Thread: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    We are rapidly reaching the point where people with no power can decide that someone else "doesn't have a meaningful version of life". Now all that's needed is some political power to back that ideology and the show is on once more.
    We were already at the point the minute we decided to create a democracy.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Yeah, it seems that way. We both agree that a fetus/unborn child is alive and I believe that being alive before consciousness isn't a quality of life that compels me to become pro-life.
    yeah i'm more interested in having the laws for both life and death agree with oneanother to simplify things a little. it seems to also meet both arguements halfway (kind of) also r.v.w. seems to agree with my arguement as well.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by majora$$hole View Post
    yeah i'm more interested in having the laws for both life and death agree with oneanother to simplify things a little. it seems to also meet both arguements halfway (kind of) also r.v.w. seems to agree with my arguement as well.
    Problem is.....the circumstnaces of the beginning of life and the end of life are not the same.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    We were already at the point the minute we decided to create a democracy.
    That's what democracy is all about? Deciding who does and who doesn't have "a meaningful version of life", and using that as an argument to end said life?

    That's not like any democracy I'm familiar with. I'm more from the 'live and let live', "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" school.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    That's what democracy is all about? Deciding who does and who doesn't have "a meaningful version of life", and using that as an argument to end said life?

    That's not like any democracy I'm familiar with. I'm more from the 'live and let live', "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you" school.
    Democracy is all about the people making their own decisions and then voting based on those ideas. So yes, in regards to abortion, people make their OWN decisions about "the meaningful version of life" and then vote accordingly. God bless America.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by majora$$hole View Post
    yeah i'm more interested in having the laws for both life and death agree with oneanother to simplify things a little. it seems to also meet both arguements halfway (kind of) also r.v.w. seems to agree with my arguement as well.
    Well there are already arguments out there that suggests babies can be 'aborted' up to the time they are two years old and that women should be forced to have abortions so perhaps some Harvard professors should advise when people should be put to death as well. How about 55? That's when people begin becoming more of a burden to society and our taxes start to go up as a result. Think that might suit the Leftists?

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Okay. I see I'm dealing with someone who has a problem with information and reality. This is not conducive to debate.
    I'm sorry you felt so maligned as to lend yourself to personal attacks. But the cold hard reality is that there is right and there is wrong and there is no middle ground. With that, people created this "grey area" as a way of coping with decisions and/or actions that they know are wrong but they wanted to do any way. Most people can't stand the idea of being thought of as bad. They want to be good. So when they do something they know is wrong, they justify it (make it good) by complicating the issue and calling it a "grey area" there by implying that there was no right answer. That makes them feel better.
    You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh; rather, serve one another humbly in love.For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Democracy is all about the people making their own decisions and then voting based on those ideas. So yes, in regards to abortion, people make their OWN decisions about "the meaningful version of life" and then vote accordingly. God bless America.
    You said "I agree - it is logical - which is why a fetus is alive when it has brain life. It just doesn't have a meaningful version of life - according to me. Life isn't particularly meaningful without consciousness".

    That is "according to you", and that is where I'm directing my question.

    According to you "a fetus is alive when it has brain life. It just doesn't have a meaningful version of life". This is not about "democracy" but your opinions, and the shared opinions of many others who have adopted this philosophy.

    It is my observation that when those with power tend to feel they have the necessary insight and intelligence to determine who has and hasn't "a meaningful version of life", that all Hell breaks loose.

    The Leftists were upset that Sarah Palin didn't abort her little boy with Down's Syndrome and were very critical of her for allowing his birth to take place. As time passes I suspect their rules about which life to allow will become even more stringent.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by CaptainCourtesy View Post
    Just as I said. All you are doing is appealing to emotion "the poor little human, boo hoo." That's an appeal to emotion logical fallacy. Make your argument without the dramatics and I won't have to call you on it.

    Your straw man argument is claiming I made an argument I never made. I never said that my answer to the complex question of what to do with unwanted chidren due to lack of abortions is to abort them. I asked a question, one which no one, including you, has answered. Again, I won't have to call you out on logical fallacies if you don't make them.
    Here's the absurdity of pro-abortion argument:

    They don't believe that a prenatal life conceived in a human womb is a prenatal human baby. They claimed it is a blob of tissue with no consciousness and no ability to feel pain. They will claim “It doesn't sway many people” even having “watched films on abortions with friends and acquaintances where they show all the gruesome stuff “.

    Including the claim that: “If someone doesn't believe that a stage of development has the full value of a fully developed human, they are likely not going to react emotionally because they do not have the same attachment to it that a person who does believe those things will.

    In their own word they claimed that it has only "the potential to develop consciousness and yet it is certainly not a human being".

    As such, they convince themselves that abortion is not murder. If that's true, if that's what they truly believe, how on earth could they be emotionally disturbed by a factual description of a procedure called Dilation and Curettage performed during a surgical abortion procedure?

    Do you get emotionally disturbed when people described the meat processing procedure? Would you accuse me of emotional appeal if I describe the butchering procedure as cutting into pieces of various sizes of meat or ground them hind legs into ground meats for sausage making? How about a description of cutting down a tree, a life no less, and shredding it into tiny pieces as mulch or pulverizing it into saw dust to be dumped into the compost pile?

    How about liposuction procedure? Would you cry foul if I tell you how your fatty tissues are being sucked out of your sagging tummy?

    Of course not. So, why would pro-abortion zealots who claim they don't believe a prenatal human life is a human being or, by their term, " a human person", get emotionally upset when a procedure of surgical abortion is factually described to them?

    Obviously, deep down they know abortion is a cold blooded murder of innocent prenatal human beings. They may vehemently deny it and cry foul, but when confronted with reality, deep down within them their conscience convicts themselves. Thereby, involuntarily and unconsciously it betrays their lies. That’s why they cry foul and cry hard they do, vehemently and loudly.

    Also, they will tell you abortion is a complex issue involving “unwanted children”. Yet, they refuse to realize that abortion is also too simple a solution to a complex problem. Not only that, it’s also a cop out option to destroy another human life to cover for the irresponsibility of the perpetrators.

    With one foot, they will stand firm on the ground of abortion to make their point, which is a moot point. But, with the other foot hanging aloft, when confronted into a tight corner, they will stand on another ground to deny their case “to abort them".

    It's an evasive behavior.

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    Re: Late Clash on Abortion Shows Conservatives’ Sway

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    Good link, Grant. Thanks.

    Here's something to ponder:

    A short journey from 'pro-choice' to infanticide

    "... the arraignment of Philadelphia abortionist Dr. Kermit Gosnell on eight murder charges: a third-degree charge for a woman who died under his knife, and seven first-degree charges of infanticide for "snipping" the spines of live babies "to ensure fetal demise": i.e. inducing births of viable thirdtrimester babies, and deliberately killing them post-delivery.

    In its 261-page report, the grand jury described the conditions at Gosnell's filthy "clinic" as rivalling those in a Third World country: unwashed instruments spreading venereal disease, cats defecating where they pleased, a padlocked emergency exit, and floors sticky with placental and fetal remains.

    Gosnell's gruesome practice was no secret, but the Pennysylvania Department of Health had decided to stop inspecting abortion clinics because "officials concluded that inspections would be 'putting a barrier up to women seeking abortions.'" ..."
    I'm surprised no one has yet come forth to cry "Boo-Hoo" on the emotional appeal thang. That insensitive reporter needs to be canned for not white washing or covering up the gruesome details. Yeah right!

    If pro-abortionists will have their way, everything would be sanitized!
    Last edited by dolphinocean; 04-14-11 at 04:10 PM.

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