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Thread: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yes, but chemicals certainly affect children and adults differently. All I asked was if you had any data to support the claim you continuously make. If it were purely physical, I could potentially buy your "educated assumption" (though even physical attacks can have differences between adults and children, but due to the leathality of firearms a bullet most likely would not have any significant difference in affect).

    I'm not making a scientific claim. I'm speaking purely based on my understanding and research on pepper spray in general, which routinely comes up that except in very freak circumstances it has no lasting effects, and based on the realities of interacting with anyone physically be it in a fight, in law enforcement, in a sport, rough housing around the house, etc. And then I was asking for peoples opinions, and at least asking for them to have some reason to back it up.

    I can back up my assertions with regards to pepper spray with links to comments regarding its safety. I can link to numerous stories where people interacting phsyically, even when not meaning to cause physical harm that lasts, actually does that. And enough of it to show that its far more common then what the experts say the risks of Pepper spray are.

    All I'm asking is for the people saying pepper spray isn't the safer option is for them to provide some kind of backing for why. Saying "Well, you don't have a study saying it is just the same for kids" isn't provindg some kind of evidence to the contrary, its just complaining about what's been presented so far.

    I'm not saying this is a scientific absolute. I'm saying based on facts I'm seeing that seems to be the case. If people can present some kind of facts, not just "umm...I disagree cause I disagree"...then i'd be happy to change my view.

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by theangryamerican View Post
    I certainly see your point, but personally, anyone threatening to stab me, regardless of age, is going to be met with a faceful of OC.
    That's fine. As I said, I'm not defending the kid. I'm not saying the police over reacted. They handled the situation fine, the kid was acting out and posing a threat; he got pepper sprayed. Shouldn't act like that, particularly against others, if you don't want to get pepper sprayed. The mom, instead of making the talk show circuit, should enforce this lesson on her child.
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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Yes, but chemicals certainly affect children and adults differently. All I asked was if you had any data to support the claim you continuously make. If it were purely physical, I could potentially buy your "educated assumption" (though even physical attacks can have differences between adults and children, but due to the leathality of firearms a bullet most likely would not have any significant difference in affect).
    not many "chemicals" in pepper spray:

    The active ingredient in pepper spray is capsaicin, which is a chemical derived from the fruit of plants in the Capsicum genus, including chilis (aka peppers, hence the name "pepper spray")

    the capsaicin is extracted from the ground fruit using a solvent like ethanol (aka the alcohol in liquor, wine and beer)

    it is then suspended in water using an emulsifier like propylene glycol (a colorless, nearly odorless, clear, viscous liquid with a faintly sweet taste, also an alcohol)


    and then pressurized to make it an aerosol.

    there are no dangerous, harmful chemicals used in making OC spray
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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Oh, so now I'm a bad parent?
    I don't believe I said that.

    I will say you're a bad role model, since you have expressed a desire to **** up some cops to 'see what they are make of'. So sue me.
    Last edited by Whovian; 04-07-11 at 05:06 PM.

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Key word being, "reasonable". IMO, pepper spraying my kid would be un-reasonable.
    smacking him around however, is ok with you.

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    If my kid is acting a fool and threatening people with sharp objects, I'd have no problem with 5-O tackling his dumbass, OC spraying his dumb ass, or tasering his dumbass. THEN...they should come to my house and OC spray me for being a ****ty parent
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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Occurs to me we would be having a different discussion had the boy had a fatal allergic reaction to its active ingredient. The NYC PD reports that allergic reactions happen to 1 out of 100. (That's "reactions", not fatal reactions.)http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb/pdf/pepperreport.pdf
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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    That's fine. As I said, I'm not defending the kid. I'm not saying the police over reacted. They handled the situation fine, the kid was acting out and posing a threat; he got pepper sprayed. Shouldn't act like that, particularly against others, if you don't want to get pepper sprayed. The mom, instead of making the talk show circuit, should enforce this lesson on her child.
    This statement I'm very much in agreement with.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Occurs to me we would be having a different discussion had the boy had a fatal allergic reaction to its active ingredient. The NYC PD reports that allergic reactions happen to 1 out of 100. (That's "reactions", not fatal reactions.)http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb/pdf/pepperreport.pdf
    Isn't it flawed to say that a substance which is intentionally made to be an irritant causes reactions? That's the whole point of OC... If it didn't have any effects, you might as well use a squirt gun on people.

    From your link:
    Intended results of the use of pepper
    spray are inflammation and swelling of the mucous membranes of the eye, nose, and throat and
    involuntary closure of the eyes. Known side effects include coughing, gagging, and
    hyperventilation
    Last edited by theangryamerican; 04-07-11 at 05:13 PM.
    "Liberty lies in the hearts of men and women; when it dies there, no constitution, no law, no court can save it; no constitution, no law, no court can even do much to help it." - Judge Learned Hand

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    Re: Misbehaving Boy, 8, Pepper Sprayed By Police

    Quote Originally Posted by MaggieD View Post
    Occurs to me we would be having a different discussion had the boy had a fatal allergic reaction to its active ingredient. The NYC PD reports that allergic reactions happen to 1 out of 100. (That's "reactions", not fatal reactions.)http://www.nyc.gov/html/ccrb/pdf/pepperreport.pdf
    we'd also be having a different discussion if the cops had done nothing and the kid had stabbed someone in their ****ing throat.
    The best argument against democracy is a five-minute conversation with the average voter.

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