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Thread: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

  1. #811
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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Probably because Reagan and Bush policies helped the average American with tax cuts that they are still getting today ...
    We're talking about the unemployed here ... income tax cuts don't help them.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    ... and neither added 4 trillion to the debt in two years.
    Percentagewise, Reagan almost did. I know you hate percentages because they expose your hypocrisy, but comparing the dollar amount in 2011 dollars with the dollar amount in 1983 dollars means absolutely nothing.

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Are you sending your Bush tax cut back every time you receive a paycheck?
    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    No, why would I? Though I was in favor of letting the tax cuts expire, which would have raised my taxes.
    Besides all that, aren't Conservatives the ones who continue to lament, "tax cuts allow wage earners to keep more of what they earn?" Why should I give back "MY" money?

    Ah! But wait!! The counter argument has become, "Well, if you're not for tax cuts you should give the money back." Tell you what, I'll give back my portion of the tax cut I received when large corporations like GE pay theirs. (And before I get derailed, let me once again go on record and say I have no problem with any individual or any company making loads of money, none whatsoever. But whenever a major corporation in America finds a way NOT to pay ANY federal taxes - ZERO (0), there's something fundamentally wrong with our tax codes!)

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    We're talking about the unemployed here ... income tax cuts don't help them.


    Percentagewise, Reagan almost did. I know you hate percentages because they expose your hypocrisy, but comparing the dollar amount in 2011 dollars with the dollar amount in 1983 dollars means absolutely nothing.
    You asked why I voted for Bush the second term and I told you. you don't like the answer, growing economy, growing employment, and less debt than obama's. Guess you won't be voting for Obama by your own standards. Percentage change means nothing, let me know when the employment gets back to pre 2008 levels. One would think by adding all that debt Obama would have generated better numbers. If he can add 4 trillion in debt in two years imagine what he can do with 6 more.

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    You think it is Federal taxpayer responsibility, yours, to pay teachers in California, Illinois, or any other state than yours? If so what are property taxes and other state taxes for?
    I think it's the responsibility of all Americans to do what they can to help all Americans. If that includes the federal government helping out states which need the help, than yes, I'm for that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Whose jobs did Obama save?
    I dunno, I'm going with the figures you posted. You said every job saved or created cost us $228,000.

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Objective Voice View Post
    Besides all that, aren't Conservatives the ones who continue to lament, "tax cuts allow wage earners to keep more of what they earn?" Why should I give back "MY" money?

    Ah! But wait!! The counter argument has become, "Well, if you're not for tax cuts you should give the money back." Tell you what, I'll give back my portion of the tax cut I received when large corporations like GE pay theirs. (And before I get derailed, let me once again go on record and say I have no problem with any individual or any company making loads of money, none whatsoever. But whenever a major corporation in America finds a way NOT to pay ANY federal taxes - ZERO (0), there's something fundamentally wrong with our tax codes!)
    Why, because it is hypocrisy to keep your own money when you are against the guy who gave it to you. Maybe you ought to take GE's lack of taxes with the guy on the Presidents Job creation committee, Jeff Immelt

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    I think it's the responsibility of all Americans to do what they can to help all Americans. If that includes the federal government helping out states which need the help, than yes, I'm for that.


    I dunno, I'm going with the figures you posted. You said every job saved or created cost us $228,000.
    Still on that merry-go-round, Obama's claim is a lie? Where were those jobs saved?

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sheik Yerbuti View Post
    I think it's the responsibility of all Americans to do what they can to help all Americans. If that includes the federal government helping out states which need the help, than yes, I'm for that.


    I dunno, I'm going with the figures you posted. You said every job saved or created cost us $228,000.
    How do you know the states couldn't have saved those jobs as they weren't forced to do that. Obama took credit for saving state jobs before giving the states the opportunity to do that. Why do you think it is my responsibility to pay for a teacher's job in California?

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    You asked why I voted for Bush the second term and I told you. you don't like the answer, growing economy, growing employment, and less debt than obama's.
    WTF?? You voted for Bush in 2004 because he added less debt than Obama?? In 2004, how did you know how much debt Obama would add??

    As far as the other factors, the economy is now growing as well. GDP in 2009 was -2.6%, in 2010 it was +2.9%. employment fell in 2009 by 3.7 million and grew by 812,000 in 2010.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Guess you won't be voting for Obama by your own standards.
    As I've said, I won't be deciding who to vote for until I know who all of the candidates are. But if I vote for Obama, I certainly hope you understand if I do so using your standards? Which is to vote for a candidate who raises unemployment and raises the debt and the deficit.


    <queue up Glory, Glory, Hallelujah> ♪♫ And to boot, if Obama lets his guard down and 4 planes get hijacked inside America within an hour and are used by terrorsists as missiles, blowing up land marks and the Pentagon, killing 3,000 people in the process, then using your standard, he's definately getting my vote. And if he warns us that unless we invade a country with WMD, we might end up with a mushroom cloud over an American city; only that country doesn't really have WMD, then again, using your standard, I'm going to lobby for the repeal of the 22nd Amendment. ♫ ♪ <end music>

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post

    Still on that merry-go-round, Obama's claim is a lie? Where were those jobs saved?
    Those are the numbers you posted. I'm sorry you don't like them.

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    Re: Obama announces his Candidacy for 2012.

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Why, because it is hypocrisy to keep your own money when you are against the guy who gave it to you. Maybe you ought to take GE's lack of taxes with the guy on the Presidents Job creation committee, Jeff Immelt
    On the contrary. I would think any hardworking, tax paying citizen who followed the law and received a tax refund should keep what is rightfully his. He'd be a fool to give it back because you can rest assured if the reverse happens - the individual owed the government - they'd be coming to collect faster than you could blink an eye!

    Interestingly enough, the argument from your side concerning tax cuts for the wealthy runs along the same line. My problem with it is in the "inequality" in the tax code that allows the "haves" to hide their money. I've heard the arguments but it appears that Conservatives refuse to accept the fact that "trickle down economics" can never work as long as the wealthiest among us hoard their money onto themselves instead of re-investing it into businesses as the theory outlines. Thus, it is a proven fact that the more you earn, the more you spend. As such, wealthy individuals don't reinvest their "earnings" back into their business ventures in the large numbers some either would like them to or as "expected of them to do." They reinvest their "profits" which can be very different. It's the main reason why one can review a company's quarterly statements and see that their profits were down, yet the CEO just walked away with a heft severage package stuffed with millions in stock options. This is what gets the average Americans so upset with corporate America.

    For me it's not jealousy or envy but rather an issue over ethics. But I suppose what's "right" for one person is "wrong" for the next.
    Last edited by Objective Voice; 04-06-11 at 05:46 PM.

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