Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234
Results 31 to 38 of 38

Thread: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

  1. #31
    Sage
    ric27's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Last Seen
    12-21-17 @ 08:34 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    7,541

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    I see them turning more fundamentalist Muslim when the current governments fall....One by one

    Remember President Obama calling for Mubarak to step down? Mubarek kept the peace with Israel and reduced tensions in the ME. So tell us how that makes him such a bad guy?

    Has there been a revolution or coup in the Arab world that actually turned out well for people in the last century? I can't think of any so from a historical perspective, the odds are much more in line with things getting worse, not better.

    Sad but true

  2. #32
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Mars View Post
    Where the hell is the leader of the free world? We need strong leadership right now.

    0bama is missing an opportunity to take advantage of the uprisings all over the ME.

    I can hear the jihadis now: "See, the infidel doesn't care about you. We can help you. Join us."
    I honestly don't understand it, unless it is deliberate.

    That seems like an Occam's Razor explanation and yet that's also too strange and conspiratorial to seriously contemplate. It sounds too much like a Mel Gibson movie script.

  3. #33
    Educator
    Ron Mars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Last Seen
    02-01-14 @ 04:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,194

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I honestly don't understand it, unless it is deliberate.

    That seems like an Occam's Razor explanation and yet that's also too strange and conspiratorial to seriously contemplate. It sounds too much like a Mel Gibson movie script.
    Which part?

    Obama missing an opportunity or jihadis trying to step into the vacuum?
    The national security of the United States can never be left in the hands of liberals.

  4. #34
    Banned
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    dimensionally transcendental
    Last Seen
    08-15-11 @ 04:31 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    7,153

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    That secnond one can't be right. It's some vast right-wing conspiracy... Obama said we stopped the advance.

  5. #35
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Mars View Post
    Which part?

    Obama missing an opportunity or jihadis trying to step into the vacuum?
    The not understanding that if Mubarek was out of the picture his suceessors would go along with Iran. Did he not know this, or give it any thought?

    And now the cry that Gadaffi must be replaced. By whom?

    On another thread there is a lot of talk about that Florida Pastor who many feel caused the deaths of UN workers by threatening or burning the Koran and then, months later, UN workers were attacked,

    This is very similar to the Danish cartoons where the riots and murders didn't take place until over a year after the cartoons were published, and with a couple more cartoons added by the Imams for good measure.

    I don't believe that these riots which killed the UN workers was spontaneous, nor do I believe it was about that Florida pastor. I believe we are facing an enemy much smarter than we are and our leadership either knows that, ignores it, or is helpless to do anything about it.

  6. #36
    Educator
    Ron Mars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Last Seen
    02-01-14 @ 04:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,194

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    The not understanding that if Mubarek was out of the picture his suceessors would go along with Iran. Did he not know this, or give it any thought?

    And now the cry that Gadaffi must be replaced. By whom?
    That the current Egyptian leaders are sending feelers to Iran is a concern no doubt. The new Iraqi government did the same thing. We have to let the people of Egypt and the other nations in political turmoil decide their own fate. Obviously you believe they will not be successful in establishing a free and peaceful nation. You may be right.

    We need to seize the moment and do everything we can to ensure these nations become free and peaceful and reject jihadis.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    On another thread there is a lot of talk about that Florida Pastor who many feel caused the deaths of UN workers by threatening or burning the Koran and then, months later, UN workers were attacked,

    This is very similar to the Danish cartoons where the riots and murders didn't take place until over a year after the cartoons were published, and with a couple more cartoons added by the Imams for good measure.

    I don't believe that these riots which killed the UN workers was spontaneous, nor do I believe it was about that Florida pastor. I believe we are facing an enemy much smarter than we are and our leadership either knows that, ignores it, or is helpless to do anything about it.
    Good points but I don't believe they are smarter than we are.

    We confine ourselves with rules of engagement and jihadis take advantage of that. They are intelligent and very resourceful.

    jihadis are like no other enemy we have faced and all of our leaders are struggling with how to defeat them. We finally started to fight them seriously after 9/11.

    This latest jihadi uprising will not be defeated solely on the battlefield. We have to let the people of these nations decide for themselves.

    We need to do everything we can to convince them that following the jihadis is not the way to go if they desire to join the free and peaceful nations of the world.
    The national security of the United States can never be left in the hands of liberals.

  7. #37
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Canada, Costa Rica
    Last Seen
    05-16-16 @ 09:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    31,645

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    [QUOTE]
    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Mars View Post
    That the current Egyptian leaders are sending feelers to Iran is a concern no doubt. The new Iraqi government did the same thing. We have to let the people of Egypt and the other nations in political turmoil decide their own fate. Obviously you believe they will not be successful in establishing a free and peaceful nation. You may be right.

    We need to seize the moment and do everything we can to ensure these nations become free and peaceful and reject jihadis.
    But how are 'the people' to do that? They don't have the power of the ballot box, the media, or the gun. Also, for the most part, they are deeply religious and not terribly well educated, in the liberal sense of the word. If the Middle East becomes one, under Iranian leadership, then it can be a real game changer. That's especially true if we have weak leadership. And the US President, who in a way represents all democracies, claiming that the US had committed past sins did not serve us (the democracies) well. It only fortified their arguments that we are all Great Satans.

    I don't want to get all conspiratorial but it is often necessary to look at the future and consider all outcomes.

    If Iran gets nukes, if they lead a united Islamic revolution, and if those Muslims already entrenched in the Western societies rise up, what is the west to do?

    The military will be no help if civilians, just bunches at a time, are the target. We will never go nuclear because there is not just one country to bomb. It is not a war in a traditional sense, which makes us quite unprepared to fight it.

    We would have to think like a Jihadist, or a well educated group of Jihadists, in order to fight against them, and it doesn't seem we are doing that, at least on the surface anyway. Certainly the public doesn't follow it much until t makes headlines, and then it gets a little scary.



    Good points but I don't believe they are smarter than we are.

    We confine ourselves with rules of engagement and jihadis take advantage of that. They are intelligent and very resourceful.

    jihadis are like no other enemy we have faced and all of our leaders are struggling with how to defeat them. We finally started to fight them seriously after 9/11.

    This latest jihadi uprising will not be defeated solely on the battlefield. We have to let the people of these nations decide for themselves.

    We need to do everything we can to convince them that following the jihadis is not the way to go if they desire to join the free and peaceful nations of the world.
    I hope you are right and I tend to think you are. Canada has been able to arrest several potential terrorists, so far, who have been captured in the very early conspiratorial stages, and the sentences are getting much longer for those found guilty. It is no longer just a slap on the wrist. And if there has been any torture it has never been made public.

    I'd still like to see a stronger US President though and more people from all countries able to recognize the threat democracies face. This does not mean we should be attacking Muslims but it does mean we should strongly support traditional western values and insist Muslims adapt to out laws and customs, rather than any of the reverse.
    Last edited by Grant; 04-04-11 at 11:32 AM.

  8. #38
    Educator
    Ron Mars's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Central Virginia
    Last Seen
    02-01-14 @ 04:12 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    1,194

    Re: Stalemate in Libya Increasingly Viewed as Likely Outcome

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    But how are 'the people' to do that? They don't have the power of the ballot box, the media, or the gun.
    They are fighting back and they are losing at the moment. For me one of the most important aspects of intervention is whether or not the people are willing to fight for their freedom.

    The Libyan people have to fight if they plan to shed Gaddafi and fight even harder if they desire to create and keep a peaceful nation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    We would have to think like a Jihadist, or a well educated group of Jihadists, in order to fight against them, and it doesn't seem we are doing that, at least on the surface anyway. Certainly the public doesn't follow it much until t makes headlines, and then it gets a little scary.
    Most of the hidden battles are intelligence gathering, tracking, and identifying jihadis.

    A lot of that happens will happen in secret for obvious reasons.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I'd still like to see a stronger US President though and more people from all countries able to recognize the threat democracies face. This does not mean we should be attacking Muslims but it does mean we should strongly support traditional western values and insist Muslims adapt to out laws and customs, rather than any of the reverse.
    I couldn't agree more.
    The national security of the United States can never be left in the hands of liberals.

Page 4 of 4 FirstFirst ... 234

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •