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Thread: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

  1. #41
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by donsutherland1 View Post
    I agree. While China's rise might be unsettling for those who truly believe the world is unipolar (the Krauthammer thesis) and fear that U.S. preeminence is slipping away, it is less unsettling for those who understand that it has been and is likely to remain multipolar. Understanding that large shared interests exist between China and the U.S. is also recognition that there is vast opportunity for a non-confrontational, mutually beneficial long-term relationship. A world in which China is counted among the world's great powers need not be a world of confrontation, Cold War, or worse. Among other things, precisely because its economic miracle has been made possible by East Asian stability, a continuation of that stability is as much in China's interest as it is in the United States'.

    To be sure, risks exist. But at this point in time, if those risks evolve to the extent that the U.S. and China are in confrontation, that outcome will more reflect bad policy choices/decisions than some immutable historic outcome.
    The Unipolar paradigm is a myth. The last attempt at it was by PNAC, when they reasoned that the US could become the world's only superpower, now that a power vacuum existed (at that time). Needless to say, it didn't work out. China has a sphere of power, so do the South American nations, and so do a couple of other areas of the world. True, the US is still the most powerful nation in the world, but it does not have the power to influence the entire world, as PNAC had hoped. In fact, the US is now experiencing a decline of it's influence in the world.

    NOTE: In a Biblical sense, America's decline in power and influence is a very good thing, as the Bible sees the Beast as, not only the world's greatest military power ever, but also the world's greatest economic power ever. To those who believe in the Bible, it has to be a very good thing if the Beast of Revelations turns out not to be America. Let the Antichrist come from someplace else.
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  2. #42
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by digsbe View Post
    I can kinda believe this. The sad thing is that in the US we are seeing less and less people go to college and obtain graduate degrees.
    Quite the opposite. We are at historical highs in college attendance:



    Graduate student enrollment grew 67% during the 97-2007 decade:

    College Student Enrollment Facts And Figures | Chillicious | All About Finance

  3. #43
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Invisible View Post
    This isn't really surprising, seeing as how China is investing its money in its people, in things like education, public transportation, internet, and so forth. How does the US expect to compete when we are going to be cutting education and not doing much about rising college tuition rates, it may soon be to the point where only a privileged few can actually afford a college education.



    Source.

    Edit: Also look here
    Throwing more money at education, does not make people more educated.
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by Taylor View Post
    Quite the opposite. We are at historical highs in college attendance:
    College attendance isn't really the problem in the U.S. College completion is. A look at 1995 and 2008 OECD statistics shows that college graduation rates have flattened in the U.S. even as those in other OECD countries have pushed higher than the U.S. In 1995, the U.S. ranked 1st in the OECD. In 2008, it had fallen to 14th.

    Highlights from Education at a Glance 2010 - Statistics - OECD iLibrary (Figure 1-7 in the 4th .pdf under "Education Levels and Student Numbers").

    From Crossing the Finish Line (Princeton University Press, 2009):

    The failure of educational attainment to continue to increase steadily is the result of problems at all stages of education, starting with pre-school and then moving through primary and secondary levels of education and on into college…

    This is not a pretty picture when looked at through the lens of America’s history of educational accomplishments during the first 75 years of the 20th century. It is an equally disturbing picture when juxtaposed with the remarkable gains in educational attainment in other countries. As is increasingly recognized, the United States can no longer claim that it is “first-in-class” in terms of continuing progress in building human capital. The 2008 annual stock-taking document produced by the Organization for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD) reported that the 2006 higher education attainment rate for 25- to 34-year olds in the United States is nearly identical to that of 55- to 64-year olds, a group 30 years their senior. In 2006, the United States ranked 10th among the members of the OECD in its tertiary attainment rate. This is a large drop from preceding years: the United States ranked 5th in 2001 and 3rd in 1998. Moreover, in the United States only 56 percent of entering students finished college, an outcome that placed this country second to the bottom of the rank-ordering of countries by completion rate.


    Source: William G. Bowen, Mathew M. Chingos, and Michael S. McPherson, Crossing the Finish Line: Completing College at America’s Public Universities, Princeton: Princeton University Press, 2009, pp.3-4.

    In recent years, some pundits have suggested that education take on a more vocational orientation. In the short-term, that might have appeal, as it costs less and might fill certain jobs. In the long-run, such an outcome would be destructive. It would undercut innovation and, in the long-run, continual innovation is what keeps societies advancing. Without continual innovation, societies become less competitive relative to others, and that development has broad adverse economic, fiscal, and social implications.
    Last edited by donsutherland1; 03-30-11 at 09:17 AM.

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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    This can be avoided it we get rid of Obama and replace him with someone who is intelligent and a Statesman.

    Obama has shown himself to be as worthless piece of garbage at everything he's done. and failed at.

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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by Demon of Light View Post
    There is way too much fear-mongering about China. People hear China is building an aircraft carrier and start losing their **** even though the French already got one, the Russians too with more on the way for them, India will have two by the time China has its one, and even Brazil has an aircraft carrier. So, in fact, all this fear about China is overblown. Certainly it is a rising power that will play a significant role in the world, but even if we had reason to be afraid of China becoming a major military player it is still not something likely in this decade. Keep in mind that the U.S. is right now capable of matching the rest of the world's carrier force 1:1 and no other country's are supercarriers of the Nimitz tonnage.
    If you lived in Taiwan or any number of other regional states that feel threatened by China's rising military, you may feel differently. Of course, once again leave it to you to take the side of a totalitarian dictatorship...
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    That will be the point at which we're really ****ed. We gave up our industrial capabilities and focused on technology; but to do that you have to remain on the forefront of science and engineering. If you don't, you won't have anything left at all. Sad that we don't really want to be #1 anymore.
    Wanting to be #1 is never an issue, many want to be #1. Bobby Knight the basketball coach had a phrase that seems to fit here:

    "The will to win is not nearly as important as the will to prepare to win".

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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by OscarB63 View Post
    that's the real question.

    they spend money educating their people
    we spend money enabling ours
    Ummm... you know Chinese students need to pay tuition to attend even elementary school, right??? China spends far less on medical care, welfare and other such expenditures than the United States does...
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    I am kind of curious how socialist China is, and what the DP socialists think of China... It seems like they have been opening the economy up a little bit, so I am not sure where they stand.
    Economically, China is more neo-mercantilist today. Their basic economic goal is to store up as much foreign reserve currency as possible through manipulating their own currency, using non-tarriff barriers to make it difficult for foreign competitors to compete in China, and the most insidious is that they require most foreign enterprises operating inside China to share technology with Chinese companies through joint ventures or other cooperative agreements. Western companies have been GIVING China the technology over the past 15 years and everyone has just stood there letting them do it...
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    Re: China 'to overtake US on science' in two years

    China is not only advancing in science, it is only leading the world in investment in alternative energy. Such leadership is consistent with its growing prowess in science and reflects the reality that China will need to greatly expand its supply of energy (a factor challenge in economic parlance) if it is to sustain its remarkable economic growth. Rather than remaining captive to today's energy realities, it is, in effect, taking measures to chart its own energy destiny.

    By addressing its own factor challenge, China is also positioning itself for leadership in what will almost certainly be one of the more important industries of the future. The growing need for energy alternatives is not confined to China, alone. Fossil fuels are a finite resource. At some point in time, a demand imbalance will make excessive reliance on such non-renewable energy sources impractical (cost and access issues). That such resources are disproportionately located in geopolitically-risky regions (a significant share of the world's proved oil reserves are located in the Mideast and up to a third of the world's natural gas reserves are in Russia) will amplify the risk of supply shocks, especially if national interests clash with market needs. As a result, as resource scarcity becomes a greater issue, one can likely expect resource nationalism to play out. Russia took such an approach during a payments dispute over natural gas. China is slowing the growth in rare earth mineral exports, some of which have significant military and technology applications.

    A "think small" approach or status quo orientation will lead to reduced strategic energy flexibility and greater vulnerability to supply shocks. Utilizing one's own resources (when possible) and developing alternatives are essential to mitigating or overcoming those risks. With insufficient domestic energy resources, China is aggressively pursuing the latter course. The BBC reported:

    China remains the world's leading investor in low-carbon energy technology, a global study has shown...

    While the US saw investment increase by 51% to $34bn, it still slipped from 2nd to 3rd in the ranking, behind Germany's $41.2bn.


    The larger point is that investment in human capital (education) is one crucial underpinning of future innovation and competitiveness. Coupling that human capital with financial investment is necessary to try to build sustainable competitive advantages. In that context, China's growing economic and military might is only part of the story. If one drills down beneath the general headlines, one finds that China is also seeking to position itself for leadership in industries that will likely play a much more prominent role in the future. Such activity increases the prospects that China could gain a qualitative edge in at least some critical high-growth economic sectors of the future, and that qualitative edge, could further augment its economic and military power.

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