Page 3 of 18 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast
Results 21 to 30 of 176

Thread: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians ...

  1. #21
    pawn in the game of life
    pragmatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    10-17-17 @ 05:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    1,984

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I wonder how many of those were legitimate kills.
    Yeah. Thought the same thing. And it does matter. One end of the spectrum is just atrocious behavior, the other end of the spectrum is murder/war crime.

    Be good to get the facts out before we get too far along in our judgements.....


    .


    “Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.”

  2. #22
    Guru
    nonpareil's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Last Seen
    07-04-15 @ 10:36 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    3,108

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    There is nothing debatable here. It seems to me that the main intent of the OP is to demonize the US military.
    This is a political forum and this is a big news story with political consequences, isn't that enough to start a thread?

    The only part of the OP that could be construed as criticism of the military is this: I don't know which bit is the worst part. The idea the photos were attempted to be hidden by the US or the apology only came when they got leaked.

    Is the OP wrong in saying that the military attempted to hide the photos and/or that the apology only came after the story has leaked?

    If the OP is wrong, then show that it is wrong and clear the criticisms against the Military's handling of this situation.

    If it is correct, then it's valid criticisms of the US military. If valid criticism base on fact is "demoniz[ing]" then the military essentially gets a free-pass with no accountability. The people at the top needs to learn that when something goes wrong, hidding them from the public (who they are supposed to work for) is not okay. There's a small group within any organisation that might do wrong, own up to that fact without being forced to by the media and learn from it.
    Last edited by nonpareil; 03-22-11 at 09:10 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Free_Radical View Post

    And I wasn't making an appeal to authority, I was making an appeal to the philosophical body of work of the founders, the worth and content of which should be well-known to anyone with a cursory understanding of basic history and philosophy.

    Brian

  3. #23
    pawn in the game of life
    pragmatic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Last Seen
    10-17-17 @ 05:33 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    1,984

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    .

    "A soldier being court-martialed on a U.S. Army base near Seattle for the murder of three Afghan civilians has agreed to plead guilty Wednesday in hopes of earning a reduced sentence, according to one of the attorneys handling his case.

    "My client is admitting on the record to three counts of murder, plus one count of conspiracy to commit assault and battery and one count of illegal drug use," said Geoffrey Nathan, a lawyer for Army Spc. Jeremy Morlock."

    Soldier to Plead Guilty in Afghan Murder Case - WSJ.com




    Just saw this. The picture is getting darker....

    .


    “Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.”

  4. #24
    Liberal Fascist For Life!


    Redress's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Georgia
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:38 AM
    Lean
    Very Liberal
    Posts
    93,284
    Blog Entries
    2

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Cole, based on the plea and the details in the OP article, it does appear to be not just murder, but premeditated murder. If what has been reported so far is true(which is an assumption and not necessarily the case), then there are no excuses for what they did. It was vile, it hurts the mission, it was wrong in every aspect and they deserve everything they get from the judicial system.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  5. #25
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,077

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by Khayembii Communique View Post
    Well it says something about the military and their role in these countries as occupiers that this is even possible.
    newsflash. the fact that there are human beings involved is what makes this possible. the us military actually see's fewer such crimes due in no small part to it's superior discipline.

    I would phrase this differently. I would say that they were living in conditions which brought this about, i.e. a violent military occupation of a foreign country.
    yes, because if there is one thing that we don't have, it's gangs in inner cities. or violent pockets of extremism in France. or cartels in Mexico.

    I see where you're coming from but I wouldn't be so apologetic as to label them "victims".
    it doesn't make them any less guilty, nor does it alter the necessary eventual response. like a beaten dog that attacks people, you can feel sorry that it turned, but you still have to put it down.

  6. #26
    Advisor Arcadius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Location
    Somewhere far away.
    Last Seen
    10-27-11 @ 07:42 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    390

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    I just don't understand when it crosses the line into atrocity. 1,000s of civilians have been killed in every U.S. military conflict. Why is it suddenly evil when these guys do it?
    Never think that war, no matter how necessary, nor how justified, is not a crime.~ Ernest Hemingway

  7. #27
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    54,618

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Im not shocked. Im repulsed and disgusted...but not shocked. I know these men are on trial and believe they will be punished to the fullest extent of the military law. In that I take comfort, knowing that we as a people dont glorify the slaughter of innocents by excusing their behavior or worse, dancing in the streets chanting how great is our God.
    These types of events always happened. Unfortunately we have a lot of soldiers today being led by soldiers who are themselves very young and immature themselves. They dont THINK long term....they dont use their executive functioning. Many arent even old enough for their brain to have fully developed. Immature'leaders of men' that allow and in fact encourage/participate in these events....no excuse. Tragic for the victims and for the families of those they are accused of killing. Tragic that their mindless acts will bring scorn and shame on other soldiers who go out of their way to serve honorably. Tragic that a handful of scumbags will be the broad brush used to paint the color and honor of the military. Tragic that they did it. Tragic that others will use it for their own purposes.

  8. #28
    Sage
    cpwill's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    USofA
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 11:30 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    57,077

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Cole, based on the plea and the details in the OP article, it does appear to be not just murder, but premeditated murder. If what has been reported so far is true(which is an assumption and not necessarily the case), then there are no excuses for what they did. It was vile, it hurts the mission, it was wrong in every aspect and they deserve everything they get from the judicial system.
    certainly so, but i would argue there are still extenuating circumstances for some kills that turn out to be illigetimate. often you don't have a clear good-guy-bad-guy dichotomy available to you in the second and a half that you have to make a decision; and after the noise is over, you've got a body. the natural impulse is to highlight the reasons why the man was guilty and why the decision to shoot was the right one. we blew an elderly man to bits in front of his entire family. why? because he accelerated a bongo truck at us after we tried to get him to stop and slow down, and it simply wasn't worth the risk that he was an SVBIED. that doesn't make him any less ultimately innocent, or any less dead. and yeah, we threw out flags and popped some smoke afterwards and Everyone Agreed that we had gone through the Entire Official Order ROE Procedure (magically, in the 3 seconds that we had after he hit the accelerator before it would have been too late) rather than simply waved a hand, a flag, and shot the grill of his vehicle.

    even the man's family said that they didn't hold us responsible. of course, we were all holding big guns and we had just blown apart their grandad, so they may have been telling us what they thought we wanted to hear. i guess i'm just trying to point out that - as obviously insanely evil as this looks - that sometimes these things can become so befuddled and grey as to defy simple analysis. I can think offhand of several Iraqi's that i know to be responsible for the deaths of good men that I would willingly murder given the ability and opportunity.
    Last edited by cpwill; 03-22-11 at 09:30 AM.

  9. #29
    Sage


    MaggieD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    Chicago Area
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    43,243
    Blog Entries
    43

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    it doesn't make them any less guilty, nor does it alter the necessary eventual response. like a beaten dog that attacks people, you can feel sorry that it turned, but you still have to put it down.
    ^^^ Sadly, that's exactly right.
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

  10. #30
    Sage
    VanceMack's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 02:10 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    54,618

    Re: The 'Kill Team' Images--US Army soldiers in Afghanistan killed innocent civilians

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadius View Post
    I just don't understand when it crosses the line into atrocity. 1,000s of civilians have been killed in every U.S. military conflict. Why is it suddenly evil when these guys do it?
    Casualties of war occur. In this instance these civilians are alleged to be the target of intentional acts.

Page 3 of 18 FirstFirst 1234513 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •