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Thread: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on rebels

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    [QUOTE=deltabtry;1059363270]
    Quote Originally Posted by Plato View Post
    No ones talking isolationist, we are talking about not being the world's policeman and being engaged in two wars currently is enough, not to mention a region which hostile to the U.S anyway. We also have a divided country currently in regards to our government not a good time to be starting something new like a war or some military incursion where collateral damage is very possible. Imagine the uproar the Arab league would have...like they always do with something goes wrong...enough already. This has to stop sometime, the U.S is broke and the people have had enough wars. I have nothing against Libya, it is that we just don't have a dog in this fight. BTW why only a few so called enlightened European countries are only involving themselves in this fight, militarily that is.
    The two major world powers in Europe are leading this with reluctant American support. They are doing so out of "enlightened self interest" which used to be an American concept that supporting freedom and democracy is also good for your economies.

    How is it not isolationist to fail to see that what happens in Libya impacts the economy of the USA? Its the same argument that America First conservatives used to appease Hitler (no European wars) when clearly WW2 was massively in the interests if the USA. The dog in the fight is clearly explained in my last post.
    There is a way to gain the whole world. It is to gain the people, and having gained them, one gains the whole world. There is a way to gain the people. Gain their hearts and minds and then you gain them. Mencius

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    [QUOTE][QUOTE=Plato;1059363250]
    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post

    You are surprised and you are not surprised?
    Please use quotes, Plato.


    Did you not notice that the Libyan terrorist also murdered non Americans?
    Of course I did, and residents of Lockerbie as well. But I recall that when the Brits were releasing Gadaffis agent many said that this was a victory for British independence, they had stopped acting as a US poodle, and would henceforth be making their own decisions. Of course this was a slap in the face to the American people but it appeared to have no effect on the British decision.
    You may have noticed that the UK has a different government now.
    I noticed, and remain indifferent.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    Quote Originally Posted by ric27 View Post
    If you're gonna jump in, jump in with both feet.
    As a former lifeguard, I can tell you that this is bad advice.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    [QUOTE=deltabtry;1059363270]
    Quote Originally Posted by Plato View Post
    No ones talking isolationist, we are talking about not being the world's policeman and being engaged in two wars currently is enough, not to mention a region which hostile to the U.S anyway. We also have a divided country currently in regards to our government not a good time to be starting something new like a war or some military incursion where collateral damage is very possible. Imagine the uproar the Arab league would have...like they always do with something goes wrong...enough already. This has to stop sometime, the U.S is broke and the people have had enough wars. I have nothing against Libya, it is that we just don't have a dog in this fight. BTW why only a few so called enlightened European countries are only involving themselves in this fight, militarily that is.
    Quite right, Deltabtry, and of course the US will get no appreciation for their efforts. Only scorn.

    The US has been doing more than it's fair share since WWII, both militarily and in terms of hands-on world aid, and it's about time Europe started taking their share. In fact their history is more entwined with the ME than is the United States. Help them with information, etc, but not with American lives ever being put at risk. I feel the same about Canada.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    [QUOTE=Plato;1059363278]
    Quote Originally Posted by deltabtry View Post

    The two major world powers in Europe are leading this with reluctant American support. They are doing so out of "enlightened self interest" which used to be an American concept that supporting freedom and democracy is also good for your economies.
    It was an American concept from the time of the Marshall Plan but with little or no cooperation from the Europeans, and of course the UN is a waste of space. Countries can do well without concerning themselves with "freedom and democracy" for others and it might be time the US to look solely after its own interests..Certainly no other countries care about freedom and democracy for others, except in a general sort of way.
    Last edited by Grant; 03-22-11 at 11:18 AM.

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    [QUOTE=Grant;1059363807]
    Quote Originally Posted by Plato View Post

    It was an American concept from the time of the Marshall Plan but with little or no cooperation from the Europeans, and of course the UN is a waste of space. Countries can do well without concerning themselves with "freedom and democracy" for others and it might be time the US to look solely after its own interests..Certainly no other countries care about freedom and democracy for others, except in a general sort of way.
    Except in a general sort of way. What does that mean.

    I'm sure the families of all this deaf British soldiers will agree with you.

    Disgusting American chauvinistic filth. The US sets itself up as leader of the free world, consumes massive amounts of the worlds resources, ensures it's currency is the worlds currency... and we then have to listen to some of it's citizens who live in ignorant bliss of the fact that the US influences the lives of practically every citizen of the world, tell us that the world is none of their business.

    The US never does anything which is not in it's own interests, including now in Libya. Never. Not once. Some of us are happy that the self interest which powers American living standards coincides with helping people achieve liberty and democracy...sometimes. Clever, been somewhere Americans know this as well despite their countrymen who imagine that we all live in unconnected little silos now.
    There is a way to gain the whole world. It is to gain the people, and having gained them, one gains the whole world. There is a way to gain the people. Gain their hearts and minds and then you gain them. Mencius

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    Plato -

    Except in a general sort of way. What does that mean.
    Please be more specific. What does what mean?

    I'm sure the families of all this deaf British soldiers will agree with you.
    Again, it's not clear what you're referring to.

    Disgusting American chauvinistic filth. The US sets itself up as leader of the free world, consumes massive amounts of the worlds resources, ensures it's currency is the worlds currency... and we then have to listen to some of it's citizens who live in ignorant bliss of the fact that the US influences the lives of practically every citizen of the world, tell us that the world is none of their business.
    The US certainly did not "set itself up as leader of the free world". It was largely a result of two European wars that led to world wars, and the expansion of Communism (another European created and often European supported menace) which thrust the Americans into that role. Who else could anyone count on but the Americans? The Chinese? The French? The Swedes?

    The US never does anything which is not in it's own interests, including now in Libya. Never. Not once.
    They certainly saved Europe's ass more than once and, more than anyone else, were the reason why Communism was defeated.They have actually assisted countries all over the world, and I have seen it more than once myself.

    Some of us are happy that the self interest which powers American living standards coincides with helping people achieve liberty and democracy...sometimes. Clever, been somewhere Americans know this as well despite their countrymen who imagine that we all live in unconnected little silos now.
    Well apparently you do know of some instances where the American people have helped others. Perhaps you want to think all of through more thoroughly before you contribute your next post on the subject.
    Last edited by Grant; 03-22-11 at 02:17 PM.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    Quote Originally Posted by Guy Incognito View Post
    As a former lifeguard, I can tell you that this is bad advice.
    To me, it is more important to focus on understanding than being understood. You can make yourself understood drawing lines in the dirt.

    That said - We will be at war with Arabs forever.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    once again, the majority of conservatives are proving to be anything but conservative when it comes to our military.

    separation of powers should require that congress gives authority for these excursions. We are not talking about an imminent danger to American lives, and we don't live under king rule, so this is a gross abuse of power.

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    Re: Breaking News: 'To my Dear Obama, our son', says Gaddafi, defending attack on reb

    Quote Originally Posted by ARealConservative View Post
    once again, the majority of conservatives are proving to be anything but conservative when it comes to our military.

    separation of powers should require that congress gives authority for these excursions. We are not talking about an imminent danger to American lives, and we don't live under king rule, so this is a gross abuse of power.
    The split between the democracies is also becoming too apparent. Some are in, others are out, and there are no clearly define goals.

    As far as I'm concerned this is a European problem and I'm for getting Canada and the US out of there.

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