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Thread: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

  1. #561
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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Sorry, but a "final warning" is not the same as the explicit authorization for the use of force. That was made pretty damn clear. As far as I'm concerned, Congress should have voted on and issued an official declaration of war in the case of both Iraq and Libya.
    You are correct. This was confirmed again during the Tony Blair Inquiry:

    "Tony Blair, summoned back to the inquiry into the Iraq invasion in light of damaging and conflicting evidence revealed since he answered questions a year ago, is to appear before Sir John Chilcot on 21 January, it has been revealed.

    A ballot has been held for 60 seats, with a third reserved for family members who lost loved ones in Iraq, the inquiry has announced. All the people who were successful in the ballot will be notified in the next few days, it said.
    The former prime minister will attend in light of evidence about the legality of the invasion, and assurances he gave George Bush.

    The inquiry is believed to be concerned about the revelation in documents released in June showing that the day before he privately assured Bush he would back US-led military action, Blair was warned by Lord Goldsmith, then attorney general, that an invasion of Iraq would be illegal.

    Documents reveal how Goldsmith repeatedly warned Blair of the consequences of invading Iraq without fresh UN authority."

    Tony Blair to appear before Iraq war inquiry on 21 January | UK news | guardian.co.uk
    Last edited by Catawba; 03-22-11 at 09:40 PM.
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  2. #562
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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    this afternoon:

    Libya war: Germans pull forces out of NATO as Libyan coalition falls apart | Mail Online

    germany's OUT

    "tension" divides the uk and us, a "war of words" over the assassination of gadaffi

    italy says france "is motivated by a desire to secure oil contracts with the future libyan govt"

    "uk ministers say the war could last 30 years"

    russia still paints our barry as richard the lionhearted

    china is as harsh

    no wonder hillary's camp leaked all that stuff about the "amateurs" in the white house

    can you deny it?

  3. #563
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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Again, personally I am not for US involvement in either case. But distinctions need to be pointed out. Still, nobody has told me why Congress hasn't voted on a declaration of war.
    If they actually called it a war then the pot would go from simmer to boil. Right now this "Over-Seas Contingency Plan" (attack with war machines) keeps the bough from breaking. (The bough being people's will to allow our government to attack people with militairy)
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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by dirtpoorchris View Post
    If they actually called it a war then the pot would go from simmer to boil. Right now this "Over-Seas Contingency Plan" (attack with war machines) keeps the bough from breaking. (The bough being people's will to allow our government to attack people with militairy)
    They should just call it what it is. Stop with all this doublespeak crap and call a spade a spade.
    Nobody who wins a war indulges in a bifurcated definition of victory. War is a political act; victory and defeat have meaning only in political terms. A country incapable of achieving its political objectives at an acceptable cost is losing the war, regardless of battlefield events.

    Bifurcating victory (e.g. winning militarily, losing politically) is a useful salve for defeated armies. The "stab in the back" narrative helped take the sting out of failure for German generals after WWI and their American counterparts after Vietnam.

    All the same, it's nonsense. To paraphrase Vince Lombardi, show me a political loser, and I'll show you a loser.
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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Last edited by The Prof; 03-22-11 at 10:08 PM.

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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    obama: days, not weeks

    the uk: 30 years

    embarrassed yet?

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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by Catawba View Post
    You are correct. This was confirmed again during the Tony Blair Inquiry:

    "Tony Blair, summoned back to the inquiry into the Iraq invasion in light of damaging and conflicting evidence revealed since he answered questions a year ago, is to appear before Sir John Chilcot on 21 January, it has been revealed.

    A ballot has been held for 60 seats, with a third reserved for family members who lost loved ones in Iraq, the inquiry has announced. All the people who were successful in the ballot will be notified in the next few days, it said.
    The former prime minister will attend in light of evidence about the legality of the invasion, and assurances he gave George Bush.

    The inquiry is believed to be concerned about the revelation in documents released in June showing that the day before he privately assured Bush he would back US-led military action, Blair was warned by Lord Goldsmith, then attorney general, that an invasion of Iraq would be illegal.

    Documents reveal how Goldsmith repeatedly warned Blair of the consequences of invading Iraq without fresh UN authority."

    Tony Blair to appear before Iraq war inquiry on 21 January | UK news | guardian.co.uk
    It's not important what the UK did or does anymore. That 'relationship' is a charade, and with Germany not getting involved and NATO in a shamblles the United States and Canada should withdraw and pursue their own interests. This is Europe's war, not anyone else's.

    UK wooed Gadhafi before Lockerbie bomber freed - World news - Europe - msnbc.com

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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    It's not important what the UK did or does anymore. That 'relationship' is a charade, and with Germany not getting involved and NATO in a shamblles the United States and Canada should withdraw and pursue their own interests. This is Europe's war, not anyone else's.

    UK wooed Gadhafi before Lockerbie bomber freed - World news - Europe - msnbc.com
    Its important if we want historical accuracy of what occurred. As for Libya, I think Congress should vote on whether we continue to support the NATO operation.
    Treat the earth well: it was not given to you by your parents, it was loaned to you by your children. We do not inherit the Earth from our Ancestors, we borrow it from our Children. ~ Ancient American Indian Proverb

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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    From an interesting article about Libya:
    "...Isn't this a rush to war? There were 17 UN resolutions regarding Iraq, Bush talked about going to war for a full year before we actually invaded, and he received Congressional approval first. After all that, liberals STILL shouted that it was a "rush to war." Meanwhile, Obama decided to bomb Libya in between making his Final Four picks and planning out a vacation to Brazil, probably because Hillary yelled at him. How about applying the same standards to Obama that you applied to Bush?"

    7 Questions For Liberals About Obama's Libyan War - Page 1 - John Hawkins - Townhall Conservative

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    Re: U.S. Tomahawk Cruise Missiles Hit Targets in Libya

    Quote Originally Posted by Porchev View Post
    From an interesting article about Libya:
    "...Isn't this a rush to war? There were 17 UN resolutions regarding Iraq, Bush talked about going to war for a full year before we actually invaded, and he received Congressional approval first. After all that, liberals STILL shouted that it was a "rush to war." Meanwhile, Obama decided to bomb Libya in between making his Final Four picks and planning out a vacation to Brazil, probably because Hillary yelled at him. How about applying the same standards to Obama that you applied to Bush?"

    7 Questions For Liberals About Obama's Libyan War - Page 1 - John Hawkins - Townhall Conservative
    I do... they were both stupid. Libya is a tad less stupid only because of events on the ground in Libya (there is an actual civil war going on and people are getting killed, unlike Iraq, which was obstensively at peace) and the fact there is a real coalition, so this is much more of an international misson. OTH, each of nebulous objectives and lack a clear exit policy, which makes it stupid.

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