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Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play slave

Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
you can certainly TEACH them......but WHY by re-enacting something that makes a student feel humiliated? stupid.
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If I were doing this, I wouldn't choose a student who I knew wasn't going to understand the point of his/her role. If the student just thought he/she was being humiliated instead of helping the class understand a very important part of our history, I would choose someone else.

Was this student "humiliated"?
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

justabubba said:
then being without an ability to identify with any 'hurt' inflicted upon the students, you acknowledge there was not damage inflicted by the teaching of the lesson in this manner
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I guess once you have created your straw man, you are very determined to stick with it.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Gardener said:
I guess once you have created your straw man, you are very determined to stick with it.
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and you are obviously without a rebuttal to my argument
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

justabubba said:
i could talk to you about playing a guitar, but that would not be the same as experiencing trying to play one

similarly, i could discuss with you about the aspects of playing the game of baseball. but until you got on the field and actually attempted to execute the activities required of a baseball position you would not really understand what was conveyed verbally

hopefully, you don't receive a drivers license simply by studying the rules of the road, passing the written test of your knowledge of those rules, without also actually driving a vehicle

none of us want to be on an airplane piloted by someone who has been lectured to about piloting requirements but has never actually flown a plane

finally to my point. sometimes, a verbal lecture without actual experience is insufficient for the one listening to actually 'get' it. probably a major reason why we have chemistry and biology labs in school instead of simply chemistry and biology lecture halls
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i disagree. chemistry and biology and driving and music lessons don't make a student feel humiliated. wrong line of reasoning, here.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
i disagree. chemistry and biology and driving and music lessons don't make a student feel humiliated. wrong line of reasoning, here.
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you wanted to know why such role playing was educationally better for the students than simply lecturing them, telling them what they should believe rather than allowing them to experience some small aspect of what it was like for slavery to exist

i prefer the way which best instructs the students - in this instance about the history lesson being taught
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

justabubba said:
you wanted to know why such role playing was educationally better for the students than simply lecturing them, telling them what they should believe rather than allowing them to experience some small aspect of what it was like for slavery to exist

i prefer the way which best instructs the students - in this instance about the history lesson being taught
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i don't prefer anything that humiliates a student, ever.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Reenacting historical events is one of the BEST ways to teach social studies. Kids remember things like that. They don't remember "blah, blah, blah" from a social studies textbook. I read in the article that the teacher divided the class into masters and slaves. I'm pretty sure she just did it like any other teacher (1, 2, 1, 2, 1, 2,...) 1s go over there - you're masters; 2s go over there - you're the slaves. It just so happened he was probably a 2. Something tells me that he went home and told his mom about his day and SHE got offended so he got offended too.

Now, if you have "masters" on the playground or in the cafeteria still treating the "slaves" as slaves, then you've got a problem. I read no indication of that.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
If I were doing this, I wouldn't choose a student who I knew wasn't going to understand the point of his/her role. If the student just thought he/she was being humiliated instead of helping the class understand a very important part of our history, I would choose someone else.

Was this student "humiliated"?
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why do this at all? it borders on incompetence. i know, let's re-enact the death camps!!
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
i don't prefer anything that humiliates a student, ever.
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So the fat kids shouldn't have to run in PE?

So the poor readers should never read aloud in class?

So the clumsy kid should not be allowed to carry his own lunch tray?

So the kid who pees his pants in school should be homeschooled from then on since kids will tease him about it forever?

You can't shield kids from humiliation. Teaching about slavery isn't a lesson in humiliation, but a lesson in remembering our past and how horrific it was. You're always going to have some student that gets embarassed about something every single day. You can't walk on eggshells because of it or dumb/dull down your lessons because it might make someone a little uncomfortable.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
why do this at all? it borders on incompetence. i know, let's re-enact the death camps!!
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Because getting out of your seat and pretending you were there in history changes you. Did you not read my story about my high school reenacting the concentration camps? It was powerful. I will never, ever forget it. It made me more aware of what happened and just a twinge of what they felt like being lead to slaughter. You never were part of a reenactment?
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
i disagree. chemistry and biology and driving and music lessons don't make a student feel humiliated. wrong line of reasoning, here.
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You seem to have a very skewed view of kids and what they go through at school.

Chemistry - the kid who accidentally drops the acid on the teacher's shoe?

Biology - the student who has to read aloud about the reproductive system?

Driving - good Lord....you can't think of ANYTHING during a driving lesson where a kid would be humiliated???

Music - try singing a solo in front of your entire class and messing up the words or hitting a wrong note.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
So the fat kids shouldn't have to run in PE?

So the poor readers should never read aloud in class?

So the clumsy kid should not be allowed to carry his own lunch tray?

So the kid who pees his pants in school should be homeschooled from then on since kids will tease him about it forever?

You can't shield kids from humiliation. Teaching about slavery isn't a lesson in humiliation, but a lesson in remembering our past and how horrific it was. You're always going to have some student that gets embarassed about something every single day. You can't walk on eggshells because of it or dumb/dull down your lessons because it might make someone a little uncomfortable.
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please mellie, use some common sense here. teaching about slavery is important, but re-enacting slave auctions is completely unnecessary, for exactly the reason you mentioned, kids are humiliated enough just by everyday life, why add to that? not play acting this particular scenario is NOT "dumbing down" anything.

i am willing to concede that possibly this teacher meant no harm, but it sounds like you are just fine with making your students uncomfortable, possibly even humiliating them. i ask you, why would YOU do this when you know a student of yours would be uncomfortable? what sort of lesson does that teach? sometimes being pc is the right thing to do.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
Because getting out of your seat and pretending you were there in history changes you. Did you not read my story about my high school reenacting the concentration camps? It was powerful. I will never, ever forget it. It made me more aware of what happened and just a twinge of what they felt like being lead to slaughter. You never were part of a reenactment?
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two words......high school. how many jews did you go to high school with?
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
You seem to have a very skewed view of kids and what they go through at school.

Chemistry - the kid who accidentally drops the acid on the teacher's shoe?

Biology - the student who has to read aloud about the reproductive system?

Driving - good Lord....you can't think of ANYTHING during a driving lesson where a kid would be humiliated???

Music - try singing a solo in front of your entire class and messing up the words or hitting a wrong note.
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silly comparisons, mellie.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
So the fat kids shouldn't have to run in PE?

So the poor readers should never read aloud in class?

So the clumsy kid should not be allowed to carry his own lunch tray?

So the kid who pees his pants in school should be homeschooled from then on since kids will tease him about it forever?

You can't shield kids from humiliation. Teaching about slavery isn't a lesson in humiliation, but a lesson in remembering our past and how horrific it was. You're always going to have some student that gets embarassed about something every single day. You can't walk on eggshells because of it or dumb/dull down your lessons because it might make someone a little uncomfortable.
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Would you have students act as Jews being led to the gas chambers?
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

liblady said:
please mellie, use some common sense here. teaching about slavery is important, but re-enacting slave auctions is completely unnecessary, for exactly the reason you mentioned, kids are humiliated enough just by everyday life, why add to that? not play acting this particular scenario is NOT "dumbing down" anything.

i am willing to concede that possibly this teacher meant no harm, but it sounds like you are just fine with making your students uncomfortable, possibly even humiliating them. i ask you, why would YOU do this when you know a student of yours would be uncomfortable? what sort of lesson does that teach? sometimes being pc is the right thing to do.
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Seems to me the student didn't care until his mother bought it up, and there've never been any complaints about this before, so it seems like one drama queen has blown it out of proportion.

EDIT: By drama queen I mean the mother, not liblady, I realised that could sound bad. :lol:
 
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Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

I'm imaginging liblady as a teacher....

Johnny throws an eraser at her. Instead of getting in his face and telling him he'll never, ever do that again and embarassing him in front of the entire class, she'll just say, "That's okay, Johnny. It just slipped out of your hand, didn't it?"

When teaching about how a bill becomes law, liblady knows the teacher beside her does a reenactment with Reps and Dems in Congress creating a bill and eventually getting to the President to sign. Liblady decides to just have the kids sit in their seats and listen to her read out of the social studies book because someone might be embarassed to be labeled "Democrat". And it's just not fair to pick one "President".

During PE, liblady decides to have the entire class run a mile. She knows Susie has a weight problem and really doesn't like to run. She knows Susie gets embarassed when she runs because she's really slow. So liblady tells Susie, "You don't have to run today. Just go sit over there and color."

You cannot shelter kids from humiliation. You'll ruin them. Lib, I have already said that if I knew a student wouldn't understand what was going on, I would choose another student. So, no, I'm not looking for students to humiliate. Good try, though.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

pbrauer said:
Would you have students act as Jews being led to the gas chambers?
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Did you not read that I did that in high school? I would do it with a high school class, absolutely.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Code:
liblady said:
two words......high school. how many jews did you go to high school with?
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I don't believe there were any jews in my class. What difference does it make?

Are you okay with doing this in a high school class?
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

Mellie said:
If I were doing this, I wouldn't choose a student who I knew wasn't going to understand the point of his/her role. If the student just thought he/she was being humiliated instead of helping the class understand a very important part of our history, I would choose someone else.

Was this student "humiliated"?
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Humiliated enough to demand an apology from the teacher, apparently. I honestly don't see the value in role-playing something like this as there are other teaching tools available, but if the kid had a problem with it he should have made it known right then and there instead of making the teacher/school go through this bull**** after the fact.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

justabubba said:
how is teaching students about the history of our nation - including the negative aspects - found to be an experiment
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There is nothing wrong with teaching about slavery, as long as it's accurate and complete. Since the first slaves brought to America were white, the white kids can play the white slaves, right? The black kids can play the black slaves, and asians can play asian slaves.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

StillBallin75 said:
Humiliated enough to demand an apology from the teacher, apparently. I honestly don't see the value in role-playing something like this as there are other teaching tools available, but if the kid had a problem with it he should have made it known right then and there instead of making the teacher/school go through this bull**** after the fact.
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I don't think that the role-playing exercise was a big deal and was probably a great teaching tool.

However, regarding your last comment, the kid was 10. So, i'm not sure that's fair to think he should have done somethign about it right there and then.
 
Re: Bad lesson? Ohio elementary school in trouble after black student made to play sl

American said:
So ludahai was teaching a class on slavery?
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U.S. History and yes, I was teaching about the impact of slavery on families and the dehumanizing aspect of slave auctions in the 1830s
 
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