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Hispanics Are Surging in Arizona

danarhea

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PHOENIX — In Arizona, fervor against illegal immigration is so intense that politicians have pushed some of the nation’s toughest laws and citizen activists have patrolled the border themselves. But census data released Thursday show another side of the population story: Arizonans are increasingly becoming Hispanic.

The irony here is pretty thick. Despite the government's harshest measures, the rate of increase of the Hispanic population is among the hugest in the United States.

For illegal immigration, Arizona authorities need to crack down, but if they take it as far as the bigotry that racial profiling is based on, then they should consider what it is like to be a minority in Arizona. After all, white people WILL be a minority in Arizona eventually. When that happens, they had better hope that the LEGAL Hispanic majority in Arizona doesn't remember what was done to them in an earlier time. If they do, then it is just possible that you might be seeing white people stopped by the police on a regular basis, and being forced to show proof that they are not members of the Ku Klux Klan.

Article is here.
 
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Article is here.

On top of that, Latino community activists here suspect that there was probably a significant undercount of the state’s Hispanic population, with many not participating to make a political point.

“They did not want to participate because they did not want the additional money that the state could get to be utilized by law enforcement and the persecution of people that are brown,” said Salvador Reza, a community activist.

Talk about a lame excuse.
 
The irony here is pretty thick. Despite the government's harshest measures, the rate of increase of the Hispanic population is among the hugest in the United States.

For illegal immigration, Arizona authorities need to crack down, but if they take it as far as the bigotry that racial profiling is based on, then they should consider what it is like to be a minority in Arizona. After all, white people WILL be a minority in Arizona eventually. When that happens, they had better hope that the LEGAL Hispanic majority in Arizona doesn't remember what was done to them in an earlier time. If they do, then it is just possible that you might be seeing white people stopped by the police on a regular basis, and being forced to show proof that they are not members of the Ku Klux Klan.

Article is here.
I don't mind that people don't agree with the Arizona immigration law, I just wish they would argue what it actually is/says rather than what it isn't. Besides, nobody can say what the effect of the law is, or what it's "done to them" as it's never even been implemented.
 
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I don't mind that people don't agree with the Arizona immigration law, I just wish they would argue what it actually is/says rather than what it isn't. Besides, nobody can say what the effect of the law is, or what it's "done to them" as it's never even been implemented.

Oh it still has an effect. That is really undeniable. Look at all the court cases, people protesting, quite possibly even people moving out due to not wanting to be caught by it if it does go into effect.
 
Oh it still has an effect. That is really undeniable. Look at all the court cases, people protesting, quite possibly even people moving out due to not wanting to be caught by it if it does go into effect.
Good point. What I should have said is that we have no way of knowing how it would be enforced.
 
The irony here is pretty thick. Despite the government's harshest measures, the rate of increase of the Hispanic population is among the hugest in the United States.

For illegal immigration, Arizona authorities need to crack down, but if they take it as far as the bigotry that racial profiling is based on, then they should consider what it is like to be a minority in Arizona. After all, white people WILL be a minority in Arizona eventually. When that happens, they had better hope that the LEGAL Hispanic majority in Arizona doesn't remember what was done to them in an earlier time. If they do, then it is just possible that you might be seeing white people stopped by the police on a regular basis, and being forced to show proof that they are not members of the Ku Klux Klan.

Article is here.

It's not against the law to be members of the KKK.

This census data is simply confirming what Arizona's been complaining about.
 
It's not against the law to be members of the KKK.

This census data is simply confirming what Arizona's been complaining about.

Just as it is not against the law to be Hispanic, which is the entire point that I was making. Do you realize you just implied that simply being Hispanic should be illegal?
 
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Just as it is not against the law to be Hispanic, which is the entire point that I was making. Do you realize you just implied that simply being Hispanic should be illegal?

I certainly didn't see that implication. Perhaps you're just reading too much into it?

See thats the problem with making the entire illegal aliens debate about race. And frankly it is a far more common tactic from the pro-illegals for the simple fact that they know they would definitely lose if they debated this subject honestly.
 
I certainly didn't see that implication. Perhaps you're just reading too much into it?

See thats the problem with making the entire illegal aliens debate about race. And frankly it is a far more common tactic from the pro-illegals for the simple fact that they know they would definitely lose if they debated this subject honestly.

Actually, you made a good point. Let me rephrase what I badly phrased in the first place.

Maggie says that it is not against the law to be members of the KKK. OK, that's a given. However, I was using hyperbole in my example, which shows that racial profiling can cut both ways. Will Hispanics demand to see papers of White people to see if they are members of the KKK, when they assume power in Arizona. Of course not. But the whole idea is not using racial profiling to see if white people are members of the KKK, nor to use racial profiling to see if Hispanics are illegal aliens. I probably could have picked a better example, but the issue is of racial profiling. In that spirit, let me redo my last post.

When Hispanics assume power in Arizona, would it be right for them to assume that all White people are capable of being white collar criminals? I would say no more right than to assume that all Hispanics are capable of being illegal immigrants.

NOTE: I brought it up in this manner, in order to bring up another point, should it arise.
 
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Just as it is not against the law to be Hispanic, which is the entire point that I was making. Do you realize you just implied that simply being Hispanic should be illegal?

No, that's not what I implied. You inferred it. ;)

It is against the law to be an illegally immigrate into the United States of America. Dan, how would you have us enforce it?
 
No, that's not what I implied. You inferred it. ;)

It is against the law to be an illegally immigrate into the United States of America. Dan, how would you have us enforce it?

Legally, of course, and that means not profiling people because of their race. That is not only unconstitutional, but racist as well.
 
Legally, of course, and that means not profiling people because of their race. That is not only unconstitutional, but racist as well.

Come on!! How would you enforce it???
 
Hispanics have always been high in numbers in the southwest. It was Mexico once and it still borders Mexico.
 
No, it's not necessary, neither is it supported by the new law.

She's asking how else would you enforce this bill if not through racial profiling. So I'm asking her if she's in support of racial profiling. Mind your business.
 
I have to ask, are you in support of racial profiling?

Immaterial strawman to my question.

How would you enforce a law that says it is against the law to immigrate illegally into the United States?

Do I hear crickets???
 
Immaterial strawman to my question.

How would you enforce a law that says it is against the law to immigrate illegally into the United States?

Do I hear crickets???

You keep running around the question. This law is not aimed at anybody other than the huge hispanic illegal immigration. There is no way that racial profiling wouldn't be used in order to enforce it. So again, are you in support of racial profiling?
 
You keep running around the question. This law is not aimed at anybody other than the huge hispanic illegal immigration. There is no way that racial profiling wouldn't be used in order to enforce it. So again, are you in support of racial profiling?

Just because a law is largely violated by one race does not mean it is racial profiling to enforce the law. Maggie is trying to get an answer of how you enforce the law. I would like to see an answer as well. If you can't check the status of people that have already violated another law, then how do you enforce the law?
 
Come on!! How would you enforce it???


By whatever means are LEGAL under the Constitution of the United States of America. And if it cannot be enforced legally, then it cannot be enforced. However, what I would do is enforce the law that no employers hire illegal aliens. That one is rather easy to enforce, through audits of payroll taxes collected, and examinations of I-9 forms. If the two do not correlate, then you have evidence of lawbreaking by employers. THAT would take care of the problem. If employers violate the law, then they should go to jail. Do not pass go, and do not collect $200.00. If the illegals can't find work, they will go home.
 
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She's asking how else would you enforce this bill if not through racial profiling. So I'm asking her if she's in support of racial profiling. Mind your business.
Sorry, didn't realize this was a private conversation. You're assertion that you have to racially profile is bogus, but I guess you don't want to hear that.
 
You keep running around the question. This law is not aimed at anybody other than the huge hispanic illegal immigration. There is no way that racial profiling wouldn't be used in order to enforce it. So again, are you in support of racial profiling?

We have Federal laws in the United States that say it is illegal for someone from another country to live in our country without going through proper channels. Either we enforce the law or it is unenforceable. Which is it? How would you enforce the law?

By whatever means are LEGAL under the Constitution of the United States of America. And if it cannot be enforced legally, then it cannot be enforced. However, what I would do is enforce the law that no employers hire illegal aliens. That one is rather easy to enforce, through audits of payroll taxes collected, and examinations of I-9 forms. If the two do not correlate, then you have evidence of lawbreaking by employers. THAT would take care of the problem. If employers violate the law, then they should go to jail. Do not pass go, and do not collect $200.00. If the illegals can't find work, they will go home.

What?? Employers?? How do employers know that someone is here illegally? I don't have an I-9 form. Does that mean I can't get a job? Who do employers demand I-9's from? How do they make that decision?
 
We have Federal laws in the United States that say it is illegal for someone from another country to live in our country without going through proper channels. Either we enforce the law or it is unenforceable. Which is it? How would you enforce the law?



What?? Employers?? How do employers know that someone is here illegally? I don't have an I-9 form. Does that mean I can't get a job? Who do employers demand I-9's from? How do they make that decision?

Immigration raids of businesses. They happen now. In fact Obama's stepped those up. Actually, I agree with Dana on this. Go after the employers.
 
Immigration raids of businesses. They happen now. In fact Obama's stepped those up. Actually, I agree with Dana on this. Go after the employers.

Stay with me, X Factor. So, ICE raids a business. How do they know who's there illegally? How do they know who to ask about being in the country illegally?
 
Just because a law is largely violated by one race does not mean it is racial profiling to enforce the law.

That is a straw man. What I'm arguing is that if the law itself leads to racial profiling then by default that's the method of enforcement.

Maggie is trying to get an answer of how you enforce the law. I would like to see an answer as well. If you can't check the status of people that have already violated another law, then how do you enforce the law?

The law bars police officers from taking race alone into consideration when asking about a person's immigration status. So what else would they take into consideration? Say during a routing traffic stop? All this running around is silly. Tell us, if the law doesn't lead to racial profiling, what does it lead to?
 
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