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Thread: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    The original intent was not so much as to export democracy as to eliminate or discourage the threat of the Taleban and terrorism. In order to do that it is necessary to have a government which is at least accountable in some way to the outside world, and if it is a functioning democracy with human rights, so much the better.
    I'm not saying I advocate this personally, but many argue that we should have had a counterterrorism strategy built around killing and eliminating the terrorists rather than a costly counterinsurgency strategy that attempted at "nation"-building.

    But if the west fails in Afghanistan, and elsewhere, it is not because we lack the military capability, it is because we lack the will.
    Our success or failure in Afghanistan will have little to do with MILITARY capability. It's not the military's job to nation-build. If we fail, it will be because it is simply impossible to nation-build in a country where no nation exists. As for the question of will, when we're facing huge problems at home, it's understandable why many Americans (idk about Canadians) simply put the Afghan war out of their mind. Many blame the anti-war movement for our failure in Vietnam. Many fail to realize that war and politics are connected, whether we like it or not. Why should America's Vietnam policy have any support or will from the people when the policy itself was so flawed to begin with?

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    I'm not saying I advocate this personally, but many argue that we should have had a counterterrorism strategy built around killing and eliminating the terrorists rather than a costly counterinsurgency strategy that attempted at "nation"-building.
    Actually that was part of the strategy Bush spoke at one time ealy during the WoT. If you recall he said that the US would fight on many fronts and that many of them would not be made public,, I think though that the intent was clear.

    But public reactions, or at least the loudest public reaction, is coming from people who don't even want suspected terrorists incarcerated, want trials in NYC for them, and so on. So if we were to listen to these protesters, especially from former allies, that plan would be difficult to carry out. Public opinion, at least from the Left, sides with terrorists and their rights, rather then the safety of those who want to live without terrorism.
    Our success or failure in Afghanistan will have little to do with MILITARY capability. It's not the military's job to nation-build. If we fail, it will be because it is simply impossible to nation-build in a country where no nation exists. As for the question of will, when we're facing huge problems at home, it's understandable why many Americans (idk about Canadians) simply put the Afghan war out of their mind. Many blame the anti-war movement for our failure in Vietnam. Many fail to realize that war and politics are connected, whether we like it or not. Why should America's Vietnam policy have any support or will from the people when the policy itself was so flawed to begin with?
    It can be part of the military job to nation-build in the form of protection of those who are doing the building but, as you say, the military is designed to win wars. And while it is not the job of the military to nation-build, neither is it the job of civilians to direct military operations. Now the military is being run too much as a political arm of the government where opinion polls are directing military operations rather than focusing on the original intent. Harvard professors should no more run the military than the military should run Harvard.

    I must add that Nixon said that the Vietnam withdrawal would be used against the US for decades, and he was right, and also that it would affect American credibility in the world as well, and he was right again.
    Last edited by Grant; 03-13-11 at 05:00 PM.

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Marshabar View Post
    End operations in Afghanistan, Karzai tells NATO

    I guess Karzai and the people of Afghanistan have decided the cure is worse than the disease. The drone attacks must be horrifying on many levels. It's too bad the coward terrorists insist on hiding behind women and children.
    The war is about caspian sea natural gas pipelines, not terrorism.

    Terrorism is just a cover story so the NeoCons, can finish executing Dick Cheneys energy policy.

    "The Energy Task Force, officially the National Energy Policy Development Group, was a task force created by then-president George W. Bush during his second week in office. Vice President Dick Cheney was named chairman. This group was intended to “develop a national energy policy designed to help the private sector, and, as necessary and appropriate, State and local governments, promote dependable, affordable, and environmentally sound production and distribution of energy for the future."

    Energy Task Force - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    I must add that Nixon said that the Vietnam withdrawal would be used against the US for decades, and he was right, and also that it would affect American credibility in the world as well, and he was right again.
    No, he was wrong. It isn't the withdrawal from Vietnam that is used against the US, it is the entire Vietnamese misadventure, including Kissinger's criminal bombing campaign against the friendly Lon Nol regime in Cambodia, which provided the impetus for the Khmer Rouge take-over and subsequent genocide.

    When will Kissinger be accorded the full war criminal status he so richly deserves?
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Kane View Post
    The war is about caspian sea natural gas pipelines, not terrorism.

    Terrorism is just a cover story so the NeoCons, can finish executing Dick Cheneys energy policy.

    "The Energy Task Force, officially the National Energy Policy Development Group, was a task force created by then-president George W. Bush during his second week in office. Vice President Dick Cheney was named chairman. This group was intended to “develop a national energy policy designed to help the private sector, and, as necessary and appropriate, State and local governments, promote dependable, affordable, and environmentally sound production and distribution of energy for the future."

    Energy Task Force - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    WOW! It's still all about oil, huh?

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    WOW! It's still all about oil, huh?
    The pipeline will carry liquid natural gas through Pakistan. Thats why we're in Pakstan also.

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant View Post
    WOW! It's still all about oil, huh?
    What else do you think it could possibly be about?
    "The crisis will end when fear changes sides" - Pablo Iglesias Turrión

    "Austerity is used as a cover to reconfigure society and increase inequality and injustice." - Jeremy Corbyn

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    No, he was wrong. It isn't the withdrawal from Vietnam that is used against the US, it is the entire Vietnamese misadventure, including Kissinger's criminal bombing campaign against the friendly Lon Nol regime in Cambodia, which provided the impetus for the Khmer Rouge take-over and subsequent genocide.

    When will Kissinger be accorded the full war criminal status he so richly deserves?
    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    No, he was wrong. It isn't the withdrawal from Vietnam that is used against the US, it is the entire Vietnamese misadventure, including Kissinger's criminal bombing campaign against the friendly Lon Nol regime in Cambodia, which provided the impetus for the Khmer Rouge take-over and subsequent genocide.

    When will Kissinger be accorded the full war criminal status he so richly deserves?
    It was a "misadventure" because it all became political rather than military, and the US eventually withdrew for political reasons, not military reasons. It was a huge mistake.

    Kissinger charged with war crimes?? Incredible!!

    What about all the Communists, thousands of whom are still alive, who should be charged with war crimes! All those murderous bastards, some of them still in power, and you want Henry Kissinger charged?

    Wow! You Eurolefties are really something else!

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    See Obama is a NeoCon, not a commie after all.

    Fox News thought if they labelled him a marxist you would not notice that the 2 parties are the same.

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    Re: End Operations in Afghanistan, Karzai Tells NATO

    You'd feel the same way too if these "friendly" forces kill your family members.

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