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Thread: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

  1. #521
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    No, from the fact that you won't directly address our arguments.
    I've directly addressed every one. Every single one. Usually repeatedly and frequently.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I've directly addressed every one. Every single one. Usually repeatedly and frequently.
    At this point, you have not at all explained how -

    The 14th Amendment + The Constitution's lack of opinion on marriage = a definition based on inequality is constitutional.

    You distracted from the argument by claiming that time determines constitutionality.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    The 14th amendment = equal protection. The Constitution has no opinion on marriage. A law that excludes people in its definition is unconstitutional.

    Explain how this is not a fact and simply a matter of 'what I think'.
    Because the constitution grants to the states the right to make laws on everything the constitution missed. The constitution does not define marriage, so the states do.

    You know what I meant. Although Title IX and many laws against discriminating against the handicapped were passed after the 14th amendment, so you're wrong again (well not wrong, but my point is proven).
    No, I don't know what you meant. When things like this change in American society, we need an Amendment to codify it. Get an Amendment. Reality: I wasn't wrong, you were.

    I never said that taking long makes something unconstitutional; I said that things can be unconstitutional regardless of how long it takes.
    And I said the opposite can be true.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    No, I think things we have no control over (race, sex, ethnicity) are protected as rights, things we do have choices over need specific protections. Things such as Religion, Sexual preference...etc.
    The 14th amendment guarantees everyone equal protection under law, so it doesn't matter if sexual preference is mentioned in the Constitution, and even if it is a choice(and I know I didn't chose pussy, pussy chose me) it doesn't matter. Equal protection is guaranteed to everyone who is a citizen of the US.
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    The 14th amendment guarantees everyone equal protection under law, so it doesn't matter if sexual preference is mentioned in the Constitution, and even if it is a choice(and I know I didn't chose pussy, pussy chose me) it doesn't matter. Equal protection is guaranteed to everyone who is a citizen of the US.
    Same-Sex Marriage & the 14th Amendment

    "But as a question of constitutional law, it's not quite that easy. For starters, the Supreme Court has made it clear that the guarantee of equal treatment within the equal protection clause does not mean that governments cannot ever treat different people differently. States need not permit children to drive cars, for example, nor must they allow senior citizens to enroll in grammar school. As a basic rule, the Court has said that it is reasonable for states to build categories or classifications into the laws that they pass, and in fact, the "rational basis test" is one of the standards used by the courts to determine whether these classifications are fair. Also known as the Lindsley test, this standard says that if the reasons for treating people differently are reasonable and logically related to the law's purpose, then they are constitutional. Opponents of gay marriage insist that there is a rational basis (usually, they argue, rooted in cultural or religious tradition) for restricting marriage to a relationship between a man and a woman."
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Because the constitution grants to the states the right to make laws on everything the constitution missed. The constitution does not define marriage, so the states do.
    States do NOT have the right to make/enforce unconstitutional laws. This is why every state had to abolish slavery, give blacks and women the right to vote and integrate schools. This is why Proposition 8 was overturned.

    No, I don't know what you meant. When things like this change in American society, we need an Amendment to codify it. Get an Amendment. Reality: I wasn't wrong, you were.
    You're right. I was wrong about that fact. Fortunately that takes absolutely nothing away from argument about constitutionality.

    And I said the opposite can be true.
    Time has nothing to do with constitutionality particularly when the amendments in question have already passed.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    At this point, you have not at all explained how -

    The 14th Amendment + The Constitution's lack of opinion on marriage = a definition based on inequality is constitutional.

    You distracted from the argument by claiming that time determines constitutionality.
    No, I addressed this specifically
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Same-Sex Marriage & the 14th Amendment

    "But as a question of constitutional law, it's not quite that easy. For starters, the Supreme Court has made it clear that the guarantee of equal treatment within the equal protection clause does not mean that governments cannot ever treat different people differently. States need not permit children to drive cars, for example, nor must they allow senior citizens to enroll in grammar school. As a basic rule, the Court has said that it is reasonable for states to build categories or classifications into the laws that they pass, and in fact, the "rational basis test" is one of the standards used by the courts to determine whether these classifications are fair. Also known as the Lindsley test, this standard says that if the reasons for treating people differently are reasonable and logically related to the law's purpose, then they are constitutional. Opponents of gay marriage insist that there is a rational basis (usually, they argue, rooted in cultural or religious tradition) for restricting marriage to a relationship between a man and a woman."
    And this is supposed to mean what exactly? Being against SSM because of religious/cultural tradition isn't enough to qualify as due process of law, so what ever you tried to do here failed miserably.
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Same-Sex Marriage & the 14th Amendment

    "But as a question of constitutional law, it's not quite that easy. For starters, the Supreme Court has made it clear that the guarantee of equal treatment within the equal protection clause does not mean that governments cannot ever treat different people differently. States need not permit children to drive cars, for example, nor must they allow senior citizens to enroll in grammar school. As a basic rule, the Court has said that it is reasonable for states to build categories or classifications into the laws that they pass, and in fact, the "rational basis test" is one of the standards used by the courts to determine whether these classifications are fair. Also known as the Lindsley test, this standard says that if the reasons for treating people differently are reasonable and logically related to the law's purpose, then they are constitutional. Opponents of gay marriage insist that there is a rational basis (usually, they argue, rooted in cultural or religious tradition) for restricting marriage to a relationship between a man and a woman."
    It's illogical and unreasonable to permit children to drive cars; it's logical and reasonable to allow two adults to get married. This is why Proposition 8 was overturned.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    I don't think God would make people homosexual then tell them not to be. Free will is one thing, but that would just be cruel.
    But God could make people homosexual and people put into the Bible that homosexuality is wrong. You have no way to prove that it was people who decided homosexuality was wrong and put it into the Bible as being from God. Or it could easily be a misinterpretation of translations between the original language of the Bible and our own. There are multiple reasons why there could be a disparity between how God made people and how that is contradicted by the Bible. Unfortunately, that may mean changing some people's view of the Bible.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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