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Thread: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

  1. #381
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tucker Case View Post
    If it's all about your religion, why bother with the natural and normal fallacies? Why not simply state:

    Premise 1: I believe the bible to be accurate about what it describes as immoral
    Premise 2: The bible describes homosexuality as immoral.
    Conclusion: Therefore I believe that homosexuality is immoral.

    At least you'd have valid logic.
    Because that's not all I believe. I also believe in science.

    The arguments you do present about normal and natural are simply not valid logic.
    There is nothing illogical about anything I've said.

    They are attempts to use things other than the bible to justify your beliefs. You don't need anything more in order to justify your beliefs about morality, though.
    Absolutely, what I would need is absolute proof to change my view of morality.

    Where you would need more than just the bible is when you take your own moral beliefs and attempt to influence legislation with it. This is why so many arguments against gay marriage are fallacious. Those who oppose gay marriage, in many cases, do so based entirely on their moral views which stem from the bible or religion.
    I'm not trying to do that though. That is not my goal.

    Yet they know a biblical basis will not be accepted for legal purposes, so they try to come up with other arguments, even though these arguments are not the one's which convinced them that homosexuality is immoral and "wrong". This is why those arguments are often illogical.
    That doesn't make them illogical, at best it makes them dishonest to the individual.

    But if your views are based on the bible and religion, just stick with that. Say "I believe homosexuality is immoral because of my religion. I don't really care if it is normal or natural. As long as it is considered immoral by my religion, I will always believe it is immoral."
    That's not how I feel. My views are based on how I was raised, my religion, and my research. Also, I do care if it's normal or natural. That would affect my belief.

    That's an honest argument because, ultimately, that's what's going on. Your views are fixed on this. I would guess that it would take nothing short of the Pope himself saying that homosexuality is morally acceptable for those views to change.
    My argument doesn't need your approval, just like any you'd make doesn't need mine.
    Last edited by mac; 03-14-11 at 04:44 PM.
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    There are a lot of taboos placed on sex by our species. Because homosexuality has historically, with few exceptions, been taboo it has become ingrained into our morality as an immoral act.
    Homosexual acts. Being gay is generally not something others either realize unless people engage in homosexual acts. It's an important distinction.
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    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

  3. #383
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    Homosexual acts. Being gay is generally not something others either realize unless people engage in homosexual acts. It's an important distinction.
    It is, and you should assume that's what I meant. I don't often spell it out like that and I should.
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    I object to your use of the phrase "supposed to".
    That's actually a fair objection. Supposed to implies that there is a rational purpose to something, instead of a purely biological purpose.

    In a biological sense, milk exists for the sole purpose of feeding mammalian young. Is that better?

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Let me get this clear: You are saying that I never provided a definition of natural?
    You did provide a definition, though it wasa very artificial definition that does not really match how the word is used in the english language.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    There is nothing illogical about anything I've said.
    I have literally listed every logical fallacy you have made. You aren't fooling anyone.

    Absolutely, what I would need is absolute proof to change my view of morality.
    Because you totally needed absolute proof to accept the Bible, right?

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    Yeah, but everyone else's point is that it's not just about the law. It's about society.
    But we are apart of society, why shouldn't the law represent us as well?

    It erupted when far more than the minority group said enough is enough. But, otherwise...yeah, I agree with that statement. Change society.
    But the majority of people didn't approve, it was against societies wishes.

    Because it's contrary to societies wishes, at least for now.
    That's not good enough.
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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Your Star View Post
    To the people who want to say homosexuality is immoral, why is it immoral?
    Because gays are icky.

    Well gay guys. Lesbians are hot. Aren't you glad you are not a guy now?
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by Redress View Post
    You did provide a definition, though it wasa very artificial definition that does not really match how the word is used in the english language.
    I disagree. I included the evolutionary purpose bit for this argument because that's how I see it. I believe it was how I defined it that was the point, no?
    ”People willing to trade their freedom for temporary security deserve neither and will lose both.” --- Ben Franklin

    Quote Originally Posted by The German View Post
    Sterotypes are mostly based on truths.

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    Re: Maryland Gay Marriage Bill sent back to cmte. Shelved for this year at least.

    Quote Originally Posted by mac View Post
    There is justification as far as you are concerned. I would say you are probably be pre-disposed to accept anything at face value that claimed homosexuality was normal, natural, and/or moral, though.
    The converse would seem to be true as well. You are not free from such pre-disposition yourself.
    We became a great nation not because we are a nation of cynics. We became a great nation because we are a nation of believers - Lindsey Graham

    Quote Originally Posted by Fiddytree View Post
    Uh oh Megyn...your vagina witchcraft is about ready to be exposed.

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