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Thread: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights withou

  1. #81
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    1. It's no coincidence that the economy thrived under Clinton and tanked gradually throughout Bush's terms and that rich, greedy types tend to flock to the Republican Party. Democrats are not innocent in pandering to corporate interests, but Republicans have the policies that attract them the most. What does a greedy corporation want more than a party the targets unions - see notorious employer Walmart's contribution to Walker's campaign.
    It is also no coincidence that the laws that caused the lending problem were enacted on Clintons watch. You of course don't have to believe me. Do some homework and you can see for yourself.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    2. It was unnecessary for the United States to get involved. We went in based on false information, it did nothing to help us, we are not the world's police and we wasted money that we could have used right about now.
    Hindesight is always 20/20 isn't it?

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    3. When I say capable, I meant with the concessions that unions said they would make. There was no need to take away any aspect of collective bargaining. And as far as that $14 trillion - it's funny how conservatives are so quick to demand middle class workers to sacrifice pay, but they don't even consider the idea that the richest of this country who are still making millions of dollars could pay some extra taxes.
    Same ole' talking points. You do of course realize that I am not a consevative right? You can find that out by looking through my 3000+ posts. As such your talking points mean nothing to me.

    And yes there was a need. Study up on unions and see how they have continueally raised pay grades and demand more and more to the point where buisnesses and manufacturing companies move out of the country because of the demands that Unions make. Granted Unions are only part of the reason. But it is still there. And another view for you to look at. Why would there even be a need to cut pay and union benefits if it wasn't hurting US and State debts? If the US was "capable of meeting the demands"? Oh wait...you'll respond with the canned reply of "because they want to hurt the workers and not big buisnesses". Do you have any idea how stupid that sounds? Every single big buisness out there needs workers. Without them they cannot exist. Just as the workers cannot work without big buisness. It is a symbiotic relationship.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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  2. #82
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Joining a union is standing up for yourself. It's a way of getting people with a common interest in the same organization so that the process can be more efficient. And their right to collective bargaining for things other than wages was taken away. But I guess it's okay that incompetent government agencies can now force teachers to take on classes with 40 students so that they get exhausted and students don't learn. Everybody wins.
    And no bill has been passed which bans unions. Everyone can still join a union if they wish to. Even in my state which is a right to work state you may join a union.
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  3. #83
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Not true. In passing the bill, Republicans stripped out ALL of the economic measures, and the version that went to the floor ONLY dealt with busting the union. NOTHING was passed that dealt with the budget. And therein, we now see the real motivation for this move, which was to repay the funding and favors given by the Koch Brothers to the Wisconsin Republican party. The GOP will soon be dead in that state. They have picked a fight that they are surely going to lose.
    I agree. Nothing less than an in-your-face assault on Americana. This shenanigans is forcing me to seriously reconsider supporting the GOP in 2012.

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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    There is absolutely NOTHING pro-working class about providing ****ty educations to poor, urban minority students because it might involve holding teachers accountable for their incompetence. I can't think of anything more anti-working class than standing in the way of education reform, which the teachers' unions have done for decades.
    If you knew anything about the education system, you would know that the biggest problems facing education are not unions but ineffective policies that you are too lazy to seek out examine because they're much more difficult to analyze that the surface aspects of complex problems like the American education system.

    The foundation of teachers unions are teachers and most teachers go into the profession to HELP students. They fight for bargaining rights to have lower classroom sizes not just because 40 students is difficult to teach, but because students learn poorly in those environments. The same goes for a lot of the other issues they bring up.

    You're repeating whatever surface analysis you got from the news - they don't stand in the way of education reform. I know many many teachers who go to EVERY SINGLE school board meeting to protest the ineffective policies that are killing education and underestimating the potential of low-income minority children. One my own relatives has gone to the state congress to talk about such problems with legislators.

    I'm so sick of this one-sided, ignorant analysis of teachers, teachers' unions and the education system. You would think that it would be common sense that they majority of teachers care about their students and enter the profession in order to educate and yet so much of the public lets a few examples of unprofessional teachers and corporate media spin against unions paralyze your critical thinking.

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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by danarhea View Post
    Not true. In passing the bill, Republicans stripped out ALL of the economic measures, and the version that went to the floor ONLY dealt with busting the union.
    If that's true, then there couldn't be a challenge. The only legal challenge to the bill would be if it affected the budget and was economic in nature. So, now you have to make a decision. Did stripping collective bargaining rights affect hte budget or no? If your answer is no, a legal challenge could not win.

    BTW, I wonder if this could be a trick. Pass it. Democrats come back to complain. In doing so, they create a quorum and a vote on the full budget bill can occur.

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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    Unions represent citizens. They are a means for citizens to negotiate so that they aren't taken advantage of. If you have a problem with what you say you do, you should probably contact all of the lobbies in Washington that are the talking heads of the privileged few.
    Wrong. GOVERNMENT represents citizens. Unions represent union members. In any negotiation for public services between the government and the union, the union is most definitely NOT the party looking out for the public's interest.
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    I agree. Nothing less than an in-your-face assault on Americana. This shenanigans is forcing me to seriously reconsider supporting the GOP in 2012.
    As long as you don't become a Democrat, I'm cool with it. LOL.
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    I'm so sick of this one-sided, ignorant analysis of teachers, teachers' unions and the education system. You would think that it would be common sense that they majority of teachers care about their students and enter the profession in order to educate and yet so much of the public lets a few examples of unprofessional teachers and corporate media spin against unions paralyze your critical thinking.
    Bull****. If those WI teachers actually cared about those children then they would have protested during non-school hours. Not pull bullcrap stunts like getting a fake doctors note in order to skip work to protest.
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

    My mind and my heart are saying I'm in my twenties. My body is pointing at my mind and heart and laughing its ass off. ~ Kal'Stang

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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by Tashah View Post
    I agree. Nothing less than an in-your-face assault on Americana. This shenanigans is forcing me to seriously reconsider supporting the GOP in 2012.
    I wonder what the response from some is going to be for your post?.....

    "That's because you are a damn Leebrul that hates America."

    LOL.
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    Re: Wisconsin Republicans vote to strip public worker collective bargaining rights wi

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive View Post
    If you knew anything about the education system, you would know that the biggest problems facing education are not unions but ineffective policies that you are too lazy to seek out examine because they're much more difficult to analyze that the surface aspects of complex problems like the American education system.
    And most of those ineffective policies are in place because the union refuses to allow any innovation or experimentation, unless it directly benefits the union itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive
    The foundation of teachers unions are teachers and most teachers go into the profession to HELP students. They fight for bargaining rights to have lower classroom sizes not just because 40 students is difficult to teach, but because students learn poorly in those environments. The same goes for a lot of the other issues they bring up.
    Sure, the unions love to tout any reforms that will increase the membership of the union, like small class sizes. It's the OTHER 90% of reforms that they block.

    Quote Originally Posted by theplaydrive
    You're repeating whatever surface analysis you got from the news - they don't stand in the way of education reform. I know many many teachers who go to EVERY SINGLE school board meeting to protest the ineffective policies that are killing education and underestimating the potential of low-income minority children. One my own relatives has gone to the state congress to talk about such problems with legislators.

    I'm so sick of this one-sided, ignorant analysis of teachers, teachers' unions and the education system. You would think that it would be common sense that they majority of teachers care about their students and enter the profession in order to educate and yet so much of the public lets a few examples of unprofessional teachers and corporate media spin against unions paralyze your critical thinking.
    I'm sure that most teachers go into it to help children. That has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that teachers' unions are cancers on society that protect bad teachers, inhibit education reforms, and overcharge taxpayers. Society would be far better off without them.
    Are you coming to bed?
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