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England 'healthier than the US

Deuce said:
Your fire department is socialized. Go down to the station and tell the guys there they do a terrible job.
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If by "socialized medicine" you want local communities to be able to elect a "health chief" and subsidize a community health department... have at it. Nothing stopping you.
 
StillBallin75 said:
lol stats...yeah Commander, you're right because you say so
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Healthcare might be better for a homeless guy in England. But if I'm dying of an extremely rare disease or injury, I DEFINITELY want to be in America where I can pay a doctor to cure me, instead of in England where they'll just let me die.
 
Cmdr Sheppard said:
Healthcare might be better for a homeless guy in England. But if I'm dying of an extremely rare disease or injury, I DEFINITELY want to be in America where I can pay a doctor to cure me, instead of in England where they'll just let me die.
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:lamo

Say hi to everyone at Fox News for me!
 
Cmdr Sheppard said:
Healthcare might be better for a homeless guy in England. But if I'm dying of an extremely rare disease or injury, I DEFINATELY want to be in America where I can pay a doctor to cure me, instead of in England where they'll just let me die.
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First of all my post was in response your ridiculous assertion that the UK is socialist. Any government/economy exists on a spectrum. Some economies have more governmental intervention than others, but that does not make them socialist. Even a "capitalist" economy like the US necessarily has many functions that are government-subsidized.

As for the bolded part. You have any evidence to back that up? You don't think insurance companies in this country wouldn't let you die in order to make a buck? If you are suffering from a rare or degenerative disease in our healthcare system, the doctors are still required to treat you but if you can't afford the most advanced treatments then your days are still numbered.
 
StillBallin75 said:
First of all my post was in response your ridiculous assertion that the UK is socialist. Any government/economy exists on a spectrum. Some economies have more governmental intervention than others, but that does not make them socialist. Even a "capitalist" economy like the US necessarily has many functions that are government-subsidized.

As for the bolded part. You have any evidence to back that up? You don't think insurance companies in this country wouldn't let you die in order to make a buck? If you are suffering from a rare or degenerative disease in our healthcare system, the doctors are still required to treat you but if you can't afford the most advanced treatments then your days are still numbered.
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In fact, if it is a rare disease, it is likely the treatment will be considered "experimental", in which case, it will in all likelyhood be denied coverage. Why pay when you can deny coverage, get sued, and pay less?
 
whysoserious said:
It's amazing the mental gymnastics conservatives will do so that they can avoid the truth that socialized medicine has already proven that it can out perform privatized medicine.
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LOL....Such as which system of Socialized medicine might you be referring to?


j-mac
 
j-mac said:
LOL....Such as which system of Socialized medicine might you be referring to?


j-mac
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Considering our life expectancy is relatively low and our costs are relatively high, while these countires life expectancies are relatively high and their costs are relatively low...

Well, I'll let you do the math.
 
Infinite Chaos said:
If you compare the calories and fats in a McDonalds / KFC / Burger King type meal and that of a similar sized fish and chips type meal you may find fish and chips is healthier. Not saying it's a health food - just less bad for you.

It's the fried Mars Bar you can buy in many Scottish fish and chips shops that are bad for you but the thread is about England's health and not Scotland's...
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Dont know where you live but Fish & Chips harder to find here in London than a native English speaker.
 
whysoserious said:
Considering our life expectancy is relatively low and our costs are relatively high, while these countires life expectancies are relatively high and their costs are relatively low...

Well, I'll let you do the math.
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Most stuff in the US is much cheaper than in the UK. Electronic goods and food for one. It's our system of social healthcare. You guys might hate hearing it, but its the truth. The NHS is great, but not without its flaws.
 
j-mac said:
LOL....Such as which system of Socialized medicine might you be referring to?


j-mac
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Well, it's hard to say, because you conservatives seem to have a definition of "socialized" that changes often. For example, buying healthcare from private insurance companies somehow manages to be called "socialism" these days.

You guys also seem to change your definition of "outperform" whenever required to keep calling socialized medicine bad.

So why don't you give your definition of those so I can answer properly.
 
The British have pretty messed up teeth. Americans are fat though. I'm not sure which is worse.
 
kaya'08 said:
Most stuff in the US is much cheaper than in the UK. Electronic goods and food for one. It's our system of social healthcare. You guys might hate hearing it, but its the truth. The NHS is great, but not without its flaws.
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Yep, it's definitely true that the cost of living in general in Europe is higher. There's junk food I could buy for cheap at 7-Eleven here that costs twice as much in some European countries. I'm not sure exactly why that is though, importation and transportation costs might have something to do with it.
 
It's Bush's fault.
 
j-mac said:
LOL....Such as which system of Socialized medicine might you be referring to?


j-mac
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J, I think this is the point whysoserious was trying to make:

health-ppp.jpg


For all the money we spend on healthcare in this country, we aren't likely to be healthier compared to other industrialized nations. And the differences in costs are VERY dramatic.
 
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whysoserious said:
It's amazing the mental gymnastics conservatives will do so that they can avoid the truth that socialized medicine has already proven that it can out perform privatized medicine.
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Rush and the Dean of Beckerwood University have them well schooled.:2wave:
 
donc said:
Hhmm…I wonder why this is? :roll:

<People living in England enjoy better health than Americans, despite less investment in healthcare, research published in the US has revealed.>


<Despite the greater use of health care technology in the US, Americans receive less preventive health care than their English counterparts.>

<They have fewer physician consultations per year. >

< Public health experts suggested more generous holiday entitlements and more favourable working conditions in the UK might also play a part.>

BBC News - England 'healthier than the US'
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Not mentioned is the fact of the waiting lists for health care services. Sounds like the people of England are just like the people of the United States....its not worth the effort to attempt to see a physician for any MINOR health problem and the only ones visiting the physicians are ones with urgent care problems or chronic conditions. The same stats would show up here....If the US had such a system in place instead of the one that is in place now where one can simply pick up a phone, make an appointment and see the Physician at the convenience of the patient or SHOP AROUND until the services wanted are found, OR sometimes just jump in your car and go to the local ER, for anything from a nose bleed to a simple cold....SIMPLY BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE NOT GETTING TREATED WHILE LEAVING A PAPER TRAIL DOES NOT PRECLUDE THOSE CONDITIONS FROM EXISTING.

To the contrary, I would suggest that what this does show is the superior flexibility of the current US SYSTEM in being able to treat EVERYONE...even those with small everyday complaints. Such will not be the case in the future....and just like England..everyone will suddenly become healthier because they are not getting treated as often. WINK,WINK..........as the health care must be distributed and RATIONED....EVEN IF YOU HAVE THE MONEY TO PAY.....cash, YOU MUST WAIT IN LINE.
 
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I live in a country with a national medical system. For basic health care access, Taiwan is FAR SUPERIOR to the United States. It is easy to see a doctor and it is much less expensive than in the United States. However, if I had a serious disease or condition that required state of the art medical equipment, I would rather be in the U.S. That isn't because Taiwanese doctors and surgeons aren't capable or skilled (on the contrary, I had a successful surgical procedure on my ankle that in the U.S. was not so successful -- but that wasn't cutting edge surgery) but because the assets in the system aren't the same as the U.S.
 
ludahai said:
I live in a country with a national medical system. For basic health care access, Taiwan is FAR SUPERIOR to the United States. It is easy to see a doctor and it is much less expensive than in the United States. However, if I had a serious disease or condition that required state of the art medical equipment, I would rather be in the U.S. That isn't because Taiwanese doctors and surgeons aren't capable or skilled (on the contrary, I had a successful surgical procedure on my ankle that in the U.S. was not so successful -- but that wasn't cutting edge surgery) but because the assets in the system aren't the same as the U.S.
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Re the bolded area

You and most people would rather be in the US in that case provided they could afford it.
 
ludahai said:
I live in a country with a national medical system. For basic health care access, Taiwan is FAR SUPERIOR to the United States. It is easy to see a doctor and it is much less expensive than in the United States. However, if I had a serious disease or condition that required state of the art medical equipment, I would rather be in the U.S. That isn't because Taiwanese doctors and surgeons aren't capable or skilled (on the contrary, I had a successful surgical procedure on my ankle that in the U.S. was not so successful -- but that wasn't cutting edge surgery) but because the assets in the system aren't the same as the U.S.
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Ok, and that is a fair point. I think one reasonable solution is to offer more preventitive care, but for major procedures you must carry your own insurance. It's a start.

But you hit on something I have long thought that people generally like their everyday care that they recieve, but the US are the innovators, we are the inventors, without our system that allows that type of risk v reward we would be without the innovations that the world relies on. Socialized medicine kills that.

j-mac
 
j-mac said:
Ok, and that is a fair point. I think one reasonable solution is to offer more preventitive care, but for major procedures you must carry your own insurance. It's a start.

But you hit on something I have long thought that people generally like their everyday care that they recieve, but the US are the innovators, we are the inventors, without our system that allows that type of risk v reward we would be without the innovations that the world relies on. Socialized medicine kills that.

j-mac
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The problem is getting BOTH benefits in the same system... THAT is the tricky part we need to figure out...
 
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