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Thread: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

  1. #151
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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    So the no-bid contract opportunities for Koch Brother owned companies and massive tax breaks for large businesses need to be in place? What do you think those are costing them (or in the case of the no-bid contract, what it's going to cost them)?
    Bold part: I'm of two minds about no-bid contracts. Also it would depend on what the contract was for I would imagine. If it is for something that could bring in more buisnesses then it could generate more money. So in the long run it may be good. Even if at the outset it costs a bit more money. If not then it should be gotten rid of imo. Granted it would have taken less money if there were bidable contracts. However the old axiom of "you pay for what you get" applies here. If you award a contract to the lowest bidder then you could quite possibly end up with crappy work done. Which would drive potential buisnesses away thereby losing money in the long run. Which was one reason why the government started using no-bid contracts. The thing about having bidable contracts for government work is that the government generally cannot pick and choose, they have to pick the lowest bid for fairness/equality reasons.

    Underlined part: Yes those should be in place as it will draw buisnesses into the area. Which means more money coming in. On a local area level this is a good thing.
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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    where's miller?

    Playing a game of political chicken, Democratic senators who fled Wisconsin to stymie restrictions on public-employee unions said Sunday they planned to come back from exile soon, betting that even though their return will allow the bill to pass, the curbs are so unpopular they'll taint the state's Republican governor and legislators.

    Sen. Mark Miller said he and his fellow Democrats intend to let the full Senate vote on Gov. Scott Walker's "budget-repair" bill, which includes the proposed limits on public unions' collective bargaining rights. The bill, which had been blocked because the missing Democrats were needed for the Senate to have enough members present to consider the bill, is expected to pass the Republican-controlled chamber.
    Wisconsin Democrats May Return Soon - WSJ.com

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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by The Prof View Post
    Well, isn't that just special? Does this mean that enough of the pending contracts have been signed in the meantime to sabotage the entire process?
    The devil whispered in my ear, "You cannot withstand the storm." I whispered back, "I am ​the storm."

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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    The Wisconsin democrats hiding from their jobs are pussies, and should be removed from office for dereliction of duty.

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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by TheBook View Post
    You seem to be missing the point. Name one company that is notably profitable (or sizeable) thats only workers are its owners. Sure, some may have started that way, but they never stayed that way.

    My company is 100% employee owned. Says so right on the trailers.


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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Originally Posted by TheBook
    You seem to be missing the point. Name one company that is notably profitable (or sizeable) thats only workers are its owners. Sure, some may have started that way, but they never stayed that way.
    ESOP Statistics

    •There are approximately 11,500 ESOPs in place in the U.S., covering 10 million employees (10% of the private sector workforce).
    •These employees draw in excess of 3% of their total compensation from ESOP contributions.
    •The growth of ESOP formation has been influenced by federal legislation. While the rapid increase in new ESOPs in the late 1980s subsided after Congress removed certain tax incentives in 1989, the overall number has remained steady with new plans replacing terminated ESOPs. Currently, it is estimated that there are approximately 11,500 ESOPs in place in the U.S. However, there is no precise way to measure this figure accurately since the overwhelming majority of ESOP companies are privately held and do not file public reports with the SEC.
    About 330 ESOPs - 3% - are in publicly traded companies. However, these companies employ just under 50% of the nation's 10 million employee owners.
    •An estimated 7,000 of the 11,500 companies have ESOPs that are large enough to be a major factor in the corporation's strategy and culture.
    •Approximately 4,500 ESOP companies are majority-owned by the ESOP.
    Approximately 3,000 are 100% owned by the ESOP.
    •About 2% of ESOP companies are unionized.
    •While ESOPs are found in all industries, over 20% of them are in the manufacturing sector.
    •At least 70% of ESOP companies are or were leveraged, meaning they used borrowed funds to acquire the employer securities held by the ESOP trustee.
    •An overwhelming majority of ESOP companies have other retirement and/or savings plans, such as defined benefit pension plans or 401(k) plans, to supplement their ESOP.
    •Of the 11,500 employee-owned companies nationwide, fewer than 2% were financially distressed when they established their ESOP.
    •Total assets owned by U.S. ESOPs is estimated to be $901 billion at the end of 2007.
    The ESOP Association | Employee ownership through employee stock ownership plans

    TheBook, do your homework.
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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by j-mac View Post
    Which part don't you understand? Honest barganing? or the ability to undo what they promise today?


    j-mac
    so tell me j, they are willing to make concessions now to help the state, why not down the road, if the state situation is considerabley improved, why shouldn't they be able to ask for some of those concessions back???

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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    There are plenty of right to work states. Instead of hollering the ole "doomsday" scenario how about you back up your assertions. Find even one such thing happening in any of the right to work states.
    Sure, I'll give you one right now. I was laid off from a job back in 1985, 2 weeks before I was vested for retirement. I was doing a better job than people who were there a lot shorter time than I was, but my pension was axed for the sake of the company's bottom line. Still, I would rather have that experience than be stuck in a Union, which I was before I got this job in a right to work state, but I am only speaking for myself. Most people would see it differently, and would probably be pretty angry.

    BTW, I don't get angry. I hustle, which is what I did. I ended up starting at the bottom in another field, and within 2 years, was making more than double the money I was making at the company that laid me off. However, I consider myself to be an exceptional person. And no, I am not conceited. Conceit is a fault, and I have none.
    Last edited by danarhea; 03-07-11 at 01:33 PM.
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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    Quote Originally Posted by randel View Post
    so tell me j, they are willing to make concessions now to help the state, why not down the road, if the state situation is considerabley improved, why shouldn't they be able to ask for some of those concessions back???

    Simple, it is those supposed concessions that have so far only been talked about, nothing has been put to paper, and in the end probably wouldn't be. It is a tactic. Secondly, it is the CB that pushed this situation to where it is today. You tell me, why should unions who give money to politicians for election be able to sit across from them to bargain their contracts? Tell me why one of the liberal, progressive heros, FDR hated PS unionization?


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    Re: Wis. governor to Dems: Return or 1,500 workers will be axed

    because public employees collectively bargaining with representatives their organizations give hundreds of millions of dollars to is not only not analagous to employees negotiating with privately operated enterprises, it's just a really dumb idea

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