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Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

It was week ago today when he had alerted the National Guard to "be ready for state workers to strike or protest".Hardly a stretch imo. :2wave:

I'd say three things are possible

1) He was blowing smoke in a scare method

2) He really believed it would be a good idea and realized (or was told) later that it would be political suicide

3) There was a misunderstanding. He really did mean that the guard may have to fill in positions (such as correctional officers in prison)

Regardless of what the answer is, it stands to reason that the guard will not be called to rise against the people.
 
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Memphis, Tenn.,of March 29, 1968 meet Madison Wi. of Feb 17,2011.:(

I was living in Memphis in 1968 and remember the riots and curfews. Calling out the National Guard saved many black businesses from being burned to the ground.

I was also living in Memphis in 1978 when the fireman's union went on strike for four days. There were hundreds of housefires from arson throughout the city. I remember seeing a house across the street from a fire station burning up while the striking fireman stood in the parking lot and watched.

In my opinion, no city, state, or federal employees should be able to join a union.
 
Teh position they hold is to represent their constituents,

Which is what they are doing.


not inhibit the represention of those who are not their constituents.

Their job is to inhibit their opponents. Besides that how would this be any different than if they had the majority and prevented republican legislation from being enacted.

I'm pissed because partisan politics has **** all over our government system. When one group of politicians uses their partisan agenda to the detriment of other peopl ewho deserve to be represented as well, everyone suffers.

Partisan politics is a good thing. It makes it harder for them to work together, which means its harder for them to screw the people.

I don't care what party is doing it or for what reasons they are doing it.

I seriously doubt that.



This is false. Their job is to represent their constituents in teh legislative process. Nothing more, nothing less. One cannot represent their constituents inteh legislativ eprocess if they are not present for the legislative process.

Again their job to is support and enact legislation they and their constituents oppose and to support and enact legislation they and their constituents want. THats why people vote for politicians based on certian political beliefs.

They do not represent their peopl ein teh legislative process by inhibiting that process.
They are representing their voters by opposing legislation that they do not want. Just like the republicans are representing their voters by voting for the anti-union laws.



Legislation should be enacted through the process that was designed for this purpose.

The democrats are not trying to enact legislation, they are trying to oppose and prevent it from happening. Is there a law that says politicians forfeit their votes if they do not show up to vote? No? So then this is just another tool.


Part of the way that the "evil" of government is mitigated is by having groups of people represented proportionally, yet while everyone supposedly has a voice.


The other is putting red tape on the government and another road blocks to slow it down.


When one group of people attempts to achieve unequally by silencing the voices o ftheir opponents, they **** on the process.

Again this is a tool of the political process.

I would bitch about this no matter what letter was next to the name, so your theory that this is nothing more than hypocricy is clearly false.

There is no issue in the world that would or could come up that would make you support politicians doing the same thing these democrats are doing? I find that incredibly hard to believe.


No, they are doing the opposite of what they were elected to do.

Wrong, they are doing what they are elected to do.
 
I was living in Memphis in 1968 and remember the riots and curfews. Calling out the National Guard saved many black businesses from being burned to the ground.

I was also living in Memphis in 1978 when the fireman's union went on strike for four days. There were hundreds of housefires from arson throughout the city. I remember seeing a house across the street from a fire station burning up while the striking fireman stood in the parking lot and watched.

In my opinion, no city, state, or federal employees should be able to join a union.

Then you should be happy that Gov. Walker doesn’t include the police union, firefighters union, or the state troopers union in his purge. Of course it must be pure coincidence that all of the above unions supported republicans during the last election.:roll:
 
So Obama argues with Arizona over trying to enforce its laws, and now he wants to take on Wisconsin, too?

Obama apparently likes being an enemy of the States.
 
Then you should be happy that Gov. Walker doesn’t include the police union, firefighters union, or the state troopers union in his purge. Of course it must be pure coincidence that all of the above unions supported republicans during the last election.:roll:



Given how the teacher union thugs act, I agree with you.... Imagine the carnage when they all lied and called in "sick".
 
So Obama argues with Arizona over trying to enforce its laws, and now he wants to take on Wisconsin, too?

Obama apparently likes being an enemy of the States.


Why are you trying to deflect from the topic of this thread? :confused:
 
Hitler, Bush, teacher worship, and class warfare. And that's just the first page!
 
Which is what they are doing.

No, they can't represent tehir consituents in the legislative process if they aren't present for the legislative process.




Their job is to inhibit their opponents.

No it's not.

Besides that how would this be any different than if they had the majority and prevented republican legislation from being enacted.

Because it would not inhibit representation.

Partisan politics is a good thing.

I absolutely disagree. Partisan politics prevents real issues from being addressed and switches teh focus form long-term to immediate gratification.

It makes it harder for them to work together, which means its harder for them to screw the people.

Partisan politics is screwing people. Nothing gets accomplished of value and real issues are overlooked because real issues don't get votes.



I seriously doubt that.

Well, considering that there is ample evidence of me bashing both parties for tactics like this available on this websit eif one simply looks for it, your doubts have no basis in reality.

Hell, from what I have seen about this bill, I would oppose it. My opinion on the issues has no bearing on how I feel a representaive democracy should be run.



Again their job to is support and enact legislation they and their constituents oppose and to support and enact legislation they and their constituents want.

their job is to vote "yay or "nay" on bills that are put forth. It is not to prevent that vote from going down just because they are pisse doff they are likely to lose that vote.

THats why people vote for politicians based on certian political beliefs.

Tehy vote for a representative because that is how the system is built. Representatives represent tehir people in teh legislative process. When their representative refuses to vote in that process, they are refusing to represent their constituents.

If peopel are voting for tehir representatives because they want them to inhibit the representative democracy itself, then they are ignorant of the system in which they live.
They are representing their voters by opposing legislation that they do not want.

tehy can't represent their voters if they do not put forth a vote. They can only represent an agenda when they refuse to vote.

Just like the republicans are representing their voters by voting for the anti-union laws.

The republicans are representing their constituents BECAUSE they are voting on the bill (regardless of which direction they vote).

If the situation were reversed, and this was a pro-union bill and the democrats were in power and teh republicans decided to oppose the bill by refusing to vote on it, they would not be representing their constituents.



The democrats are not trying to enact legislation, they are trying to oppose and prevent it from happening.

And the only way to do this while repreesnting their constituents is to vote against the bill.

Is there a law that says politicians forfeit their votes if they do not show up to vote? No? So then this is just another tool.

Just because it isn't against the law doesn't mean it isn't unethical and a deriliction of duty. Appeal to authority or law is also a logical fallacy.





The other is putting red tape on the government and another road blocks to slow it down.

That only inhibits the democratic process. Red tape and aprtisanship are two reasons WHY governemnt is considered an "evil".


Again this is a tool of the political process.

It's a tool of the parties used to retain power and subdue the democratic process. It is an abuse of the system.



There is no issue in the world that would or could come up that would make you support politicians doing the same thing these democrats are doing?

None. I'm fairly consistent in keeping my ideological beliefs about systems of governance separate from my positions about certain issues. This is why, despite the fact that I personally abhor the Immigration law that was passed by Arizona, I have consistently argued in favor of the right of Arizonans to have such a law passed.

I find that incredibly hard to believe.

What you find difficult to believe has no bearing on what is actually fact.




Wrong, they are doing what they are elected to do.

False. They cannot represent their consituents in the legislative process if they aren't present of for that process. The only reason state representatives exist is to vote on legislation so that there doesn't need to be an direct vote on every issue. By refusing to vote, tehy are not acting as representatives.

(BTW, the ultimate hindrance to passing laws would be a direct vote that required a 3/4ths majority. If you really think that teh goal of the legislative process is to make things as hard as possible, that would be the best approach)
 
Then you should be happy that Gov. Walker doesn’t include the police union, firefighters union, or the state troopers union in his purge. Of course it must be pure coincidence that all of the above unions supported republicans during the last election.:roll:

Not true. All of the fire and police unions did not support Walker's campaign.
 
In Wisconsin, 1100 teachers called in "sick" to protest the governor's new budget.

I didn't know a lack of pork could cause swine flu.- Fred Thompson
 
I found the real crux of the teacher's union complaint:

Milwaukee Teachers Fight for Viagra Coverage
Despite Facing Budget Cuts and Layoffs, Teachers Fight For Taxpayer-Funded Erectile Dysfunction Drug

(AP) With the district in a financial crisis and hundreds of its members facing layoffs, the Milwaukee teachers union is taking a peculiar stand: fighting to get its taxpayer-funded Viagra back.

The union has asked a judge to order the school board to again include Pfizer Inc.'s erectile dysfunction drug and similar pills in its health insurance plans.
 
This is a subversion of the democratic process. I hope the Republicans just let 'em stay in Illinois. We could use their spendable income. Chicken ****s.
 
This is a subversion of the democratic process. I hope the Republicans just let 'em stay in Illinois. We could use their spendable income. Chicken ****s.

They don't want to come back anytime soon. They are staying at the Best Western Clock Tower Resort in Rockford. The Dems favorite restaurant is there. It's called the Tilted Kilt. If you want to see why they like it so much, here's a link:

Tilted Kilt - The Best Looking Sports Pub You've Ever Seen - Home
 
This has nothing to do for "the rich". Dude spending is too high and these union members dont deserve a pension. Not in this economy. They need to do what every other human should do..... prepare for after retirement. This isnt a corporate greed issue. This is a tax payer issue. Its not like these workers are suffering because of their pay. Hell techers dont even work the whole year and they get paid more than ME! Screw THAT!

yeah, it does.......this is simply an attemt by the wealthy to gut the middle class so's john galt and his buddies can get wealthy
 
Union thugs, in bed with democrat politicians, once again, think they shouldn't have to make the sacrifices that everyone else has to.

What evidence do you have that these people are THUGS? - whatever that is .... and define it while you are at it.
 
Given how the teacher union thugs act, I agree with you.... Imagine the carnage when they all lied and called in "sick".

What is your evidence of teacher union thug acts in Wisconsin?
 
What evidence do you have that these people are THUGS? - whatever that is .... and define it while you are at it.

They look like thugs to me....

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I guess they didn't get the memo to tone the rhetoric down.
 
yeah, it does.......this is simply an attemt by the wealthy to gut the middle class so's john galt and his buddies can get wealthy

It is heart warming to see that some people get it. Thank you.
 
yeah, it does.......this is simply an attemt by the wealthy to gut the middle class so's john galt and his buddies can get wealthy

How is cutting spending making the rich, richer? Why can't the unions pay for their own healthcare and plan their own retirement as many other Americans must do out of their OWN paychecks?
 
from Gill

They look like thugs to me....

People engaged in their First Amendment rights look like thugs to you?!?!?!?

Are you an American who believes in the rights afforded to citizen under the US Constitution?
 
This whole thing is a ginned up controversy manufactured by a radical right wing politician as part of an ideological effort to attack working people by destroying their unions. TPM for Feb 17th

Wisconsin's new Republican governor has framed his assault on public worker's collective bargaining rights as a needed measure of fiscal austerity during tough times.

The reality is radically different. Unlike true austerity measures -- service rollbacks, furloughs, and other temporary measures that cause pain but save money -- rolling back worker's bargaining rights by itself saves almost nothing on its own. But Walker's doing it anyhow, to knock down a barrier and allow him to cut state employee benefits immediately.

Mad In Madison: Wisconsin Workers Protest Against Governor's Budget Proposals
Furthermore, this broadside comes less than a month after the state's fiscal bureau -- the Wisconsin equivalent of the Congressional Budget Office -- concluded that Wisconsin isn't even in need of austerity measures, and could conclude the fiscal year with a surplus. In fact, they say that the current budget shortfall is a direct result of tax cut policies Walker enacted in his first days in office.

"Walker was not forced into a budget repair bill by circumstances beyond he control," says Jack Norman, research director at the Institute for Wisconsin Future -- a public interest think tank. "He wanted a budget repair bill and forced it by pushing through tax cuts... so he could rush through these other changes."

"The state of Wisconsin has not reached the point at which austerity measures are needed," Norman adds.

In a Wednesday op-ed, the Capitol Times of Madison picked up on this theme.

In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state's budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.
To the extent that there is an imbalance -- Walker claims there is a $137 million deficit -- it is not because of a drop in revenues or increases in the cost of state employee contracts, benefits or pensions. It is because Walker and his allies pushed through $140 million in new spending for special-interest groups in January.

You can read the fiscal bureaus report here (PDF). It holds that "more than half" of the new shortfall comes from three of Walker's initiatives:

$25 million for an economic development fund for job creation, which still holds $73 million because of anemic job growth.
$48 million for private health savings accounts -- a perennial Republican favorite.
$67 million for a tax incentive plan that benefits employers, but at levels too low to spur hiring.
In essence, public workers are being asked to pick up the tab for this agenda. "The provisions in his bill do two things simultaneously," Norman says. "They remove bargaining rights, and having accomplished that, make changes in the benefit packages." That's how Walker's plan saves money. And when it's all said and done, these workers will have lost their bargaining rights going forward in perpetuity.

Expect to see more of this in states as right wingers intentionally destroy their own state governments fiscal health in order to then destroy unions and working people.
 
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