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Thread: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    Almost enough to be considered a real response. Want to tell us what about this issue makes it so obvious that public employees should not be allowed to unionize? Or would you care to stick to vague talking points contributing nothing to the debate at hand?
    Students throughout Wisconsin have been unable to go to school for the past few days.

    FDR summed it up nicely:

    “Meticulous attention should be paid to the special relations and obligations of public servants to the public itself and to the Government….The process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service....a strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent on their part to obstruct the operations of government until their demands are satisfied. Such action looking toward the paralysis of government by those who have sworn to support it is unthinkable and intolerable.”
    Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    Almost enough to be considered a real response. Want to tell us what about this issue makes it so obvious that public employees should not be allowed to unionize? Or would you care to stick to vague talking points contributing nothing to the debate at hand?
    Because Unions have gone form being entities to force bad employers from changing their ways into entities that exist to extract as much out of the employer as they can, up to and including causing businesses to fail. Take that into Gov't, which tends to run inefficiently as a general rule, wasteful with money even, and what do you get? Chaos. Oh sure, it starts out nice and fun, but over time the Unions DEMAND more and more and Gov't being run by politicians that need reelection money and voter bases to stay in power bow to the demands until eventually the Gov't in question becomes over burdened. And instead of the Unions understanding this, they feel ENTITLED to the money and benefits until it starts falling apart and cuts are seriously discussed. Then the Unions bring out their members, call the media and protest in the streets.

    Wisconsin can ill afford the continued burdens economically, and the Unions are being UNREASONABLE in their demands. Something has to give. If the Unions win... the state goes belly up. It's like a parasite that doesn't care about the host it's killing, just as long as it gets what it wants RIGHT NOW!
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Because Unions have gone form being entities to force bad employers from changing their ways into entities that exist to extract as much out of the employer as they can, up to and including causing businesses to fail. Take that into Gov't, which tends to run inefficiently as a general rule, wasteful with money even, and what do you get? Chaos. Oh sure, it starts out nice and fun, but over time the Unions DEMAND more and more and Gov't being run by politicians that need reelection money and voter bases to stay in power bow to the demands until eventually the Gov't in question becomes over burdened. And instead of the Unions understanding this, they feel ENTITLED to the money and benefits until it starts falling apart and cuts are seriously discussed. Then the Unions bring out their members, call the media and protest in the streets.

    Wisconsin can ill afford the continued burdens economically, and the Unions are being UNREASONABLE in their demands. Something has to give. If the Unions win... the state goes belly up. It's like a parasite that doesn't care about the host it's killing, just as long as it gets what it wants RIGHT NOW!
    You say something has to give, but the fact of the matter is the unions are WILLING TO GIVE IT. This is about disguising a union bust as a budget crisis.

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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    And I will point out again, as I'm not sure how far back you've read Mr V., but a lot of this is about favoritsm. The public safety unions, the same who supported walker in his election, go untouched while Walker touts fiscal responsibility and "everyone has to give" rhetoric.

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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    You say something has to give, but the fact of the matter is the unions are WILLING TO GIVE IT. This is about disguising a union bust as a budget crisis.
    Really? I don't think the states demands are that burdensome. Of course, you're a liberal, I'm a conservative so our ideas of what's right is going to be opposite.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by MrVicchio View Post
    Really? I don't think the states demands are that burdensome. Of course, you're a liberal, I'm a conservative so our ideas of what's right is going to be opposite.
    So do you find it shady that the public safety unions are exempt?

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    Mr v.,

    Midwestlib is not your stereotypical what libs see. He's not parroting media matters Nor is he a blind partisan.

    We would be wise to consider his positions no matter how much we may disagree.

    I disagree with almost everything thus far but his honesty and pov is refreshing for both sides to see. He presents it without ego and hes willing to listen to oir side.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    So do you find it shady that the public safety unions are exempt?
    Perhaps, it could also be they didn't want the PSU to go bonkers too. One problem at a time.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    Mr v.,

    Midwestlib is not your stereotypical what libs see. He's not parroting media matters Nor is he a blind partisan.

    We would be wise to consider his positions no matter how much we may disagree.

    I disagree with almost everything thus far but his honesty and pov is refreshing for both sides to see. He presents it without ego and hes willing to listen to oir side.
    If you notice my friend, I am taking my time to respond to him and NOT be a jerk about it. I always give new folks a chance. I merely pointed out that our two differing views on the issue lies in the fact we have different POV's when it comes to political issues maybe a reason we see the issue so differently.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Wisconsin Governor to Missing Democrats: Do Your Job

    Quote Originally Posted by Midwest Lib View Post
    You say something has to give, but the fact of the matter is the unions are WILLING TO GIVE IT. This is about disguising a union bust as a budget crisis.
    Really? Do you actually know the facts? The unions are only being asked to contribute 12% to their Medical insurance coverage...the private sector contributes 20% or better. The unions are being asked to pay 5% into their own pension plans, the private sector averages well over 7%. There is no demand for a decrease in pay, they still will be averaging more than 30% more than their private sector counter parts. But this legislation will stop the laying off of over 5 thousand public employees if the Union would concede these to small demands.

    But....it was just weeks ago, the left was preaching to the right about being CIVIL as leadership talk does effect the population, just today we see signs calling the governor of Wis. Hitler, and a Terrorist, the end of democracy (Which I kind of agree with if the union constitutions are allowed to be superior to the oath these PUBLIC SERVANT take to defend our national CONSTITUTION) while the children are being denied an education...yet the left continually TALKS about the value of education. Where is the Prez...chastising all the hate filled angry speech, as he did only weeks ago...nope, He comes out and says this is an attack on UNIONS. When in reality the BUDGET must be saved or there will be 5000 fewer UNION MEMBERS with jobs shortly. The hypocrisy is so thick you can cut it with a knife.
    Last edited by Walter; 02-18-11 at 11:28 PM.

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