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Thread: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    It creates wealth because it is a vehicle in order for people to maximize their efforts.
    Government intervention doesn't maximize private industry. A lack of government intervention maximizes private industry.

    Taking the highway system as an example, it allows for a greater volume of shipping than would otherwise be possible. It makes the shipping easier too. It is essentially a capital investment in the same way a stamping machine would be for a machine shop.
    Does the government buy the stamping machine? No?

    It comes from taxes.
    And, where do taxes come from?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Of course they wasted their money; all the more reason why I oppose bailouts.
    Fair enough. Money was going to get spent, where should it have been spent? Bailouts for the wealthy, or work projects for the middle class and poor to make it through? I'd prefer the work projects. Actually, I would have preferred the proper oversight and regulation necessary in the first place to have avoided this whole mess. But it is what it is, and now here we sit. I think we are served better collectively through work projects than through bailouts.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Yeah, the Weimar government tried that to fix their economy. Sorry, but paying a million bucks for a loaf of bread won't be an economically positive sign.
    We'd just revalue our currency.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Ok, that's fine; tell me again how that justifies wasting billions more on a friggin' train line?
    People need jobs. The "solutions" we've done thus far are not solutions for us, but ways to keep the rich rich while the rest of us are left on our own. By spending the money on an actual national high speed rail system you will create temporary jobs so that people can start getting back to work. Not only do they earn wages to pay taxes, but you'll put them back into the economy so they can start consuming again. We net out a national high speed rail system as well, which will prove very useful and convienent for traveling around the country. It will spur people to visit friends/family more by making the trips cheaper and more accessable, it will spur tourism to particular States for the same reason. We all win with a high speed rail system.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    But you sure do sound like a Libbo.
    That's just a deflect designation in order to disregard what someone has said. I'm not a liberal, not in the modern sense anyway.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Government intervention doesn't maximize private industry. A lack of government intervention maximizes private industry.
    Ok, so I explain how it works and you reply with a mere statement of principal with nothing to back it up? Please use logic.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Does the government buy the stamping machine? No?
    The stamping machine was a comparison, so I do not suspect that they would buy a stamping machine, unless it was a different agency (for example the US mint would probably buy a stamping machine).

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    And, where do taxes come from?
    People and entitites that pay the taxes.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    How so? Am I going to be able to buy my own train, put it on this line and operate a train business?
    Possibly. Depends on how large an infrastructure you can build. Government owns all the rail lines now, the rail companies are allowed to use the rail system. So I don't see why you would necessarily be forbidden from using the rail for commercial purposes if we develop it well enough.

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Tell me that you have enough common sense to know that that won't go away, just because you're getting on a train.
    They can stick to the planes. Currently, the rail system while it does have security it is not on the level of TSA. TSA can stay away. They'll just have to find a different set of chumps to feel up.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

    Quote Originally Posted by A. de Tocqueville
    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    A true, national high speed rail would be well worth the investment of money in addition to providing many jobs to see people through the economic turndown. I mean, that's if you care about the average American instead of sending the billions upon billions of dollars to bailouts of the banks and CEOs who made the mess.
    There's more $gazillions from the Chinese. Maybe if we buy the rail cars from them they'll give us a discount.
    "He who does not think himself worth saving from poverty and ignorance by his own efforts, will hardly be thought worth the efforts of anybody else." -- Frederick Douglass, Self-Made Men (1872)
    "Fly-over" country voted, and The Donald is now POTUS.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Fair enough. Money was going to get spent, where should it have been spent? Bailouts for the wealthy, or work projects for the middle class and poor to make it through? I'd prefer the work projects. Actually, I would have preferred the proper oversight and regulation necessary in the first place to have avoided this whole mess. But it is what it is, and now here we sit. I think we are served better collectively through work projects than through bailouts.
    Neither! How many times do I have to say that?? Work programs are nothing more than welfare.



    We'd just revalue our currency.
    Since it's that easy, we can all just stay home and wait for the gubmint check to come on the first of the month.



    People need jobs. The "solutions" we've done thus far are not solutions for us, but ways to keep the rich rich while the rest of us are left on our own. By spending the money on an actual national high speed rail system you will create temporary jobs so that people can start getting back to work. Not only do they earn wages to pay taxes, but you'll put them back into the economy so they can start consuming again. We net out a national high speed rail system as well, which will prove very useful and convienent for traveling around the country. It will spur people to visit friends/family more by making the trips cheaper and more accessable, it will spur tourism to particular States for the same reason. We all win with a high speed rail system.
    The solution to the economy and unemployment, is for people to stop believing that the government isn't the solution.



    That's just a deflect designation in order to disregard what someone has said. I'm not a liberal, not in the modern sense anyway.
    Anyone that believes that government is the solution to economic ills and unemployment, is a Liberal, my friend. Sorry.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    How? It's better for the environment, cheaper to run, and causes people to venture out more because of the fact that it is cheaper and allows them to travel further and more often.

    Where is the downside? Charlotte is going to build a highspeed train to Washington D.C. and I, along with others here in Charlotte, are extremely excited about the prospect of being able to get from here to D.C. or NYC in a reasonable amount of time for a reasonable price.

    I might even drive my electric car to the train station when it is built in a few years. How awesome would that be?
    It costs more then it's worth, is economically unsustainable, and American's don't do trains like Europeans do.
    Climate, changes. It takes a particularly uneducated population to buy into the idea that it's their fault climate is changing and further political solutions can fix it.



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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by megaprogman View Post
    Ok, so I explain how it works and you reply with a mere statement of principal with nothing to back it up? Please use logic.
    Your principal is wrong. After trillions of dollars being spent, how many jobs have been created by the government?



    The stamping machine was a comparison, so I do not suspect that they would buy a stamping machine, unless it was a different agency (for example the US mint would probably buy a stamping machine).
    IOW, you don't have a clue what I'm telling you? In one ear and out the other?



    People and entitites that pay the taxes.
    And, that's where the government gets 90+% of it's revenue. That being the case, the government can't create wealth.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Ikari View Post
    Possibly. Depends on how large an infrastructure you can build. Government owns all the rail lines now, the rail companies are allowed to use the rail system. So I don't see why you would necessarily be forbidden from using the rail for commercial purposes if we develop it well enough.
    Ohhhhh, so I have to build my own rail line. I see. So how is the interstate system a reasonable comparison? It's not...is it?



    They can stick to the planes. Currently, the rail system while it does have security it is not on the level of TSA. TSA can stay away. They'll just have to find a different set of chumps to feel up.
    Until terrorists frag a passenger car and then guess what.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Florida scraps high-speed rail plan pushed by Obama

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    Some of you seem to be conflating "profitable" with "good policy." Is the interstate highway system profitable for the government? No...it costs billions to build and maintain, and generates almost no revenue aside from a few toll roads. Yet very few people would say that the interstate highway system was a bad investment.

    I think high-speed rail would be much the same. Will it bring in more government revenue than it costs? No, of course not. But that's not the goal. The goal is to provide a benefit to society.
    Then let the states work it out without the Fed shoving money they borrowed down their throats to put it in. If Colorado Nevada and California want to support a high speed rail line, they shoudl work it out and pay for their respective amounts if it makes sense to them. This whole, "it benefits society" nonsense is creepy. (Oh and btw, we all know we can't afford it right now right?)
    I think if Thomas Jefferson were looking down, the author of the Bill of Rights, on whats being proposed here, hed agree with it. He would agree that the First Amendment cannot be absolute. - Chuck Schumer (D). Yet, Madison and Mason wrote the Bill of Rights, according to Sheila Jackson Lee, 400 years ago. Yup, it's a fact.


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