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Thread: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murder of

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by Degreez View Post
    There is a huge difference between unauthorized abortions and unlawful abortions. Unauthorized abortions are caused by bodily injury to a pregnant female. Unlawful abortions occur when the doctor does not receive informed consent, which is a misdemeanor.
    I didn't realize the distinction. It was unauthorised abortion I had in mind.

    The other pieces of legislation belong to South Dakota Women’s Health and Human Life Protection Act (HB 1215), where some portions are in force as of 2006 while others take force upon a SCOTUS decision in the afirmative of States rights over Federal rights.

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    I didn't realize the distinction. It was unauthorised abortion I had in mind.

    The other pieces of legislation belong to South Dakota Women’s Health and Human Life Protection Act (HB 1215), where some portions are in force as of 2006 while others take force upon a SCOTUS decision in the afirmative of States rights over Federal rights.
    HB 1215 was rejected by voter referndum in 2006: South Dakota Nixes Abortion Ban; Michigan Voters OK Anti-Affirmative Action Initiative - Politics | Republican Party | Democratic Party | Political Spectrum - FOXNews.com

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    So can you and I agree that the law should have an amendment that protects abortion providers pursuing their profession according to state and federal laws? Such a provision would remove such protections from abortion providers who do so against state and federal law. Is that fair?
    Any licensed medical practitioner carrying out a lawful abortion should be free from threat of deadly force, yes, I agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    In the Scott Roeder case and the particulars around it, yes, you are right. But you have to remember that many of the critics of Roeder suggest that he was "pushed" into killing Tiller by other extremists who wouldn't bear any of the responsibility of their role in Tiller's murder.
    My point in that regard is only to illustrate the difference between a political organization and a random lone wolf. If the abortion is lawful, then any act against the physician, staff or facility is unethical and unlawful, regardless; as it should be. IMO, after the fact, the matter turns from whether or not a crime was committed, to what kind of crime it was.

    The Obama Administration was quick to say that Scott Roeder's actions were not terrorism. While he may have been influenced by the radical group Army of God, he did not act on their behalf, nor was the murder for a clear political gain. The courts decided that Scott Roeder's actions, while radical and idealistic, were not political. Thus it was not terrorism.

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    So what pro-choicers fear is that a male partner, or even some other family member, of a woman they know is seeking an abortion will use lethal force "to prevent harm to the unborn child." And that person will be pushed into it by pro-life militants.
    I'll come clean and confess that if she is seeking an unlawful abortion, then the family member is justified. However, if she is seeking a legal abortion, then she has to be allowed to pursue it.

    Note it doesn't necessarily matter if the law, as it is amended now, allows such an interpretation or not. What matters is that such pro-life militants may convince that person to use violence against abortion providers by lying to them about the effect of the amendment. So making such a clarification in the law could preempt militants from convincing others to commit violent acts with the amendment as a justification for it.
    Well sure, I can agree with that. I think militant groups will use any tool and any justification they can find.

    Quote Originally Posted by samsmart View Post
    And I hope you're right and that the exception for legal abortion providers is installed. I just wanted to point out that pro-choicers didn't criticize this amendment to strike back at pro-lifers but rather as an effort to stop violence that may be initiated against militants who makes things worse for both sides.
    The pro-choice source I used in making the OP played on the fact that the law is not complete, no where near, even, in order to sensationalize a few headlines. I understand that, they're just doing their job.

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    All are cases where someone is illegally performing an action.That is significantly different than someone LEGALLY performing an action.
    An action which kills or harms and innocent human being.



    Yes, extremists do think its pretty simple.
    A pro-lifer/anti-abortionist believes that the child in the womb has the same right to life as you or me and deserves the same legal protections.This view is only extreme in the eyes of abortionist.

    They also think bombing buildings is perfectly justifable and is nothing at all similar to terrorism.
    Would support vigilante action if law enforcement refused to stop a killer? Most people who are actually honest would say yes and cheer the individual who stopped this killer and call him a hero.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    No. I'd push for the law making it legal to kill a gay person to be overturned, but I would not push for a law legally allowing people to kill someone for performing a legal action.
    And what if that fails? Go oh well nothing can be done?
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    And what if that fails? Go oh well nothing can be done?
    Don't you like how pro-choice is strangely quiet on unlawful late-term abortions?

    They just want to jump right into clinic bombings as though they happen all the time. Pro-choice takes the radical behavior of a domestic terrorist group and paint all of pro-life/anti-abortion with the same broad brush. I suppose these are the same people who insist all Muslims are terrorists and that all gays are pedophiles.

    Here's a challenge for pro-choice: please paint a hypothetical where you would support a family member using lethal force to stop a wanted abortion.
    Last edited by Jerry; 02-17-11 at 01:08 PM.

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde


  8. #138
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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    I support this law. I believe people should be allowed to use lethal force in order to protect an unborn child that is at threat for murder and being attacked.
    When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser. -Socrates
    Tired of elections being between the lesser of two evils.

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Don't you like how pro-choice is strangely quiet on unlawful late-term abortions?
    Speaking out against unlawful late term abortions goes against their treating a child in the womb as a human being beliefs.

    They just want to jump right into clinic bombings as though they happen all the time.Pro-choice takes the radical behavior of a domestic terrorist group and paint all of pro-life/anti-abortion with the same broad brush. I suppose these are the same people who insist all Muslims are terrorists and that all gays are pedophiles.
    I think its funny that they act as though only pro-life/anti-abortion people are guilty of violence.

    AbortionViolence.com
    Pro-Abortion Violence
    Moms For Life: Pro-Abortion Violence Escalates: Man Pulls Gun on Protestors at Planned Parenthood

    Here's a challenge for pro-choice: please paint a hypothetical where you would support a family member using lethal force to stop a wanted abortion.
    That's like asking a crackhead to not smoke crack out of his own free will. It isn't going to happen.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 02-17-11 at 01:35 PM.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: South Dakota Justifiable Homicide Bill Under Fire as Critics Say It Invites Murde

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Speaking out against unlawful late term abortions goes against their treating a child in the womb as a human being beliefs.



    I think its funny that they act as though only pro-life/anti-abortion people are guilty of violence.

    AbortionViolence.com
    Pro-Abortion Violence
    Moms For Life: Pro-Abortion Violence Escalates: Man Pulls Gun on Protestors at Planned Parenthood



    That's like asking a crackhead to not smoke crack out of his own free will. It isn't going to happen.
    I just can't believe anyone on the left actually had a firearm

    Oh noes, you can't use a gun to defend your family, but can sure as hell shoo away protesters with one
    Last edited by Jerry; 02-17-11 at 01:41 PM.

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