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Thread: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

  1. #151
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    That's funny coming from somebody calling himself a Conservative, and not an Idependent... Were you cult following Bush when he spent a trillion dollars too?
    I was against the Bush spending but when I voted in 2000 I had a choice, Bush vs. Gore and then in 2004 it was Bush vs. Kerry. I chose Bush twice and voted wisely. During the Bush term we had a recession when he took office and then 9/11. 9/11 cost the country according to the GAO over a trillion dollars and then he left the country in a recession. From 2007 to 2010 5 trillion has been added to the debt. Democrats controlled Congress during those 4 years and no President spends a dime without Congressional approval.

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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    What you want is someone else to take over your personal responsibility issues? Why do you believe the Federal Govt. can give you what you WANT? What you seem to want is the utopia that liberals always promise and never deliver. A govt. that is big enough to give you all that you WANT is also big enough to take it all away. Our Constitution guarantees equal opportunity, you want equal outcome. Affordable healthcare is a relative term and different depending on the individual. In spite of history you seem to believe the govt. can provide affordable anything? Name for me one thing that the govt. has provided that has reduced costs and improved quality?
    Liblady says "i WANT access to decent, affordable healthcare for all. i WANT access to a good education for all. i WANT our corporations to stop polluting our earth while raping consumers. i WANT equal opportunity for all. i WANT our country to continue to be a beacon of hope. "... and you respond by attacking her for being a liberal.

    You always do this Conservative... just attack liberals and lecture them. You lectured her about responsibilities like she isn't a responsible adult who wants something all Americans do, instead, you could have reminded her that Conservatives want affordable healthcare too and have a better plan. You come off like Conservatives don't care or give a sh*t about the people or their needs, and that's kind of the stereotype liberals like to portray of Conservatives.. WTG

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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    I was against the Bush spending but when I voted in 2000 I had a choice, Bush vs. Gore and then in 2004 it was Bush vs. Kerry. I chose Bush twice and voted wisely. During the Bush term we had a recession when he took office and then 9/11. 9/11 cost the country according to the GAO over a trillion dollars and then he left the country in a recession. From 2007 to 2010 5 trillion has been added to the debt. Democrats controlled Congress during those 4 years and no President spends a dime without Congressional approval.
    So it's always the liberals fault... but you aren't a "cult follower?"

  4. #154
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    I don't think Europe has as much debt though... America will have to spend less or pay off some major debts to be on the same level of European socalism
    Where have you been for the last year. Several European nations have a larger debt to GDP ratio than the U.S. It is hard to believe that just three years ago a 300 billion deficit got people upset, now because of partisan politics people brush off trillion dollar deficits.

    This game to insure some cheap politician gets reelcted while bankrupting the nation should sicken everyone.

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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Let's see: National debt percentage increase, year-to-year:
    • 2000-2001 2% (Clinton's last budget, dot-com bubble burst),
    • 2001-2002 7% (Bush's first budget),
    • 2002-2003 9% (Bush's second budget),
    • 2003-2004 9% (Bush's third budget),
    • 2004-2005 8% (Bush's fourth budget),
    • 2005-2006 7% (Bush's fifth budget),
    • 2006-2007 6% (Bush's sixth budget),
    • 2007-2008 11% (Bush's seventh budget, real estate bubble burst),
    • 2008-2009 19% (Bush's eighth budget, financial industry collapse),
    • 2009-2010 14% (Obama's first budget),
    • 2010-2011 4% (Obama's second budget, half year).

    The structural deficit was created in Bush's first term when the Senate was evenly split between the parties and the House controlled by the G.O.P. It was exacerbated by the 2003 tax cut when both houses were controlled by the Republicans. To be sure popular Democrats supported these irresponsible policies but Republicans have owned them all along.

    But, I'm sure you see it differently. More important is focusing on real solutions and those don't honestly consist solely of budget cuts or tax increases. Only a combination of the two will help America out of this hole.

    Obama doesn't get any credit for solving the problem; at least, not so far. The G.O.P. by offering ridiculous, even harmful policies aren't helping either. I honestly doubt the Tea Party has anything realistic to contribute now or the future. I suspect the 112th Congress will end up passing the problem to the 113th with little change.

    See also: Government - Historical Debt Outstanding - Annual 2000 - 2010
    See also: Party In Power - Congress and Presidency - A Visual Guide To The Balance of Power In Congress, 1945-2008
    “Real environmentalists live in cities, and they visit what's left of the wilderness as gently and respectfully as possible.” — Donna Moulton, letter to the editor, Tucson Weekly, published on August 23, 2001

  6. #156
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by SheWolf View Post
    Liblady says "i WANT access to decent, affordable healthcare for all. i WANT access to a good education for all. i WANT our corporations to stop polluting our earth while raping consumers. i WANT equal opportunity for all. i WANT our country to continue to be a beacon of hope. "... and you respond by attacking her for being a liberal.

    You always do this Conservative... just attack liberals and lecture them. You lectured her about responsibilities like she isn't a responsible adult who wants something all Americans do, instead, you could have reminded her that Conservatives want affordable healthcare too and have a better plan. You come off like Conservatives don't care or give a sh*t about the people or their needs, and that's kind of the stereotype liberals like to portray of Conservatives.. WTG
    Thanks for the advice, I have been wrong many times but not in my responses to Liblady. We have a long history and if it were anyone else I would probably handle it differently but not with her.

  7. #157
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Let's see: National debt percentage increase, year-to-year:
    • 2000-2001 2% (Clinton's last budget, dot-com bubble burst),
    • 2001-2002 7% (Bush's first budget),
    • 2002-2003 9% (Bush's second budget),
    • 2003-2004 9% (Bush's third budget),
    • 2004-2005 8% (Bush's fourth budget),
    • 2005-2006 7% (Bush's fifth budget),
    • 2006-2007 6% (Bush's sixth budget),
    • 2007-2008 11% (Bush's seventh budget, real estate bubble burst),
    • 2008-2009 19% (Bush's eighth budget, financial industry collapse),
    • 2009-2010 14% (Obama's first budget),
    • 2010-2011 4% (Obama's second budget, half year).

    The structural deficit was created in Bush's first term when the Senate was evenly split between the parties and the House controlled by the G.O.P. It was exacerbated by the 2003 tax cut when both houses were controlled by the Republicans. To be sure popular Democrats supported these irresponsible policies but Republicans have owned them all along.

    But, I'm sure you see it differently. More important is focusing on real solutions and those don't honestly consist solely of budget cuts or tax increases. Only a combination of the two will help America out of this hole.

    Obama doesn't get any credit for solving the problem; at least, not so far. The G.O.P. by offering ridiculous, even harmful policies aren't helping either. I honestly doubt the Tea Party has anything realistic to contribute now or the future. I suspect the 112th Congress will end up passing the problem to the 113th with little change.

    See also: Government - Historical Debt Outstanding - Annual 2000 - 2010
    See also: Party In Power - Congress and Presidency - A Visual Guide To The Balance of Power In Congress, 1945-2008
    Quite a change, I don't see that Clinton surplus that you claim existed. The GOP offered nothing from 2007-2011 because they had no control and were shut out of the process. nice try. Notice that your balance of power stops at 2008, wonder why? Could it be that because 5 trillion was added to the debt from 2007-2010?

  8. #158
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Chappy View Post
    Let's see: National debt percentage increase, year-to-year:
    • 2000-2001 2% (Clinton's last budget, dot-com bubble burst),
    • 2001-2002 7% (Bush's first budget),
    • 2002-2003 9% (Bush's second budget),
    • 2003-2004 9% (Bush's third budget),
    • 2004-2005 8% (Bush's fourth budget),
    • 2005-2006 7% (Bush's fifth budget),
    • 2006-2007 6% (Bush's sixth budget),
    • 2007-2008 11% (Bush's seventh budget, real estate bubble burst),
    • 2008-2009 19% (Bush's eighth budget, financial industry collapse),
    • 2009-2010 14% (Obama's first budget),
    • 2010-2011 4% (Obama's second budget, half year).

    The structural deficit was created in Bush's first term when the Senate was evenly split between the parties and the House controlled by the G.O.P. It was exacerbated by the 2003 tax cut when both houses were controlled by the Republicans. To be sure popular Democrats supported these irresponsible policies but Republicans have owned them all along.

    But, I'm sure you see it differently. More important is focusing on real solutions and those don't honestly consist solely of budget cuts or tax increases. Only a combination of the two will help America out of this hole.

    Obama doesn't get any credit for solving the problem; at least, not so far. The G.O.P. by offering ridiculous, even harmful policies aren't helping either. I honestly doubt the Tea Party has anything realistic to contribute now or the future. I suspect the 112th Congress will end up passing the problem to the 113th with little change.

    See also: Government - Historical Debt Outstanding - Annual 2000 - 2010
    See also: Party In Power - Congress and Presidency - A Visual Guide To The Balance of Power In Congress, 1945-2008
    You probably know that the stimulus package that was enacted in the 1st quarter of 2009 was added to the Bush 2008-2009 number so the chart is garbage. You also probably know that as the debt number grows the annual debt as a % of total debt goes down.

    So if the best you can do is cheap numbers games, it adds nothing to a serious discussion of a real problem.

  9. #159
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    Quite a change, I don't see that Clinton surplus that you claim existed. The GOP offered nothing from 2007-2011 because they had no control and were shut out of the process. nice try. Notice that your balance of power stops at 2008, wonder why? Could it be that because 5 trillion was added to the debt from 2007-2010?
    Had to address the 2009 deficit as well because as usual you try and re-write history. Did Bush sign the approx 800 billion stimulus supplemental in February 2009? did any of that affect the 2009 deficit? How about the 50 billion GM/Chrysler takeover? How about the 100 billion dollar war funding supplemental in first quarter 2009? How about the 350 billion that Bush left Obama out of the TARP funding? Why are you ignoring those and blaming it all on Bush? By the way did Obama vote for the 700 billion TARP fund? Let's be intellectually honest for a change.

  10. #160
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    Re: Obama's FY 2012 Budget

    Quote Originally Posted by washunut View Post
    You probably know that the stimulus package that was enacted in the 1st quarter of 2009 was added to the Bush 2008-2009 number so the chart is garbage. You also probably know that as the debt number grows the annual debt as a % of total debt goes down.

    So if the best you can do is cheap numbers games, it adds nothing to a serious discussion of a real problem.
    Chappy seems to believe that he/she is dealing with a typical group of liberals who buy what they are told and aren't well informed. Apparently trillion dollar deficits don't matter since they are a smaller percentage of the total debt. Now I have heard everything

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