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Obama Health-Care Reform Act Ruled Unconstitutional(edited)

Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

If I have a group of 100 people who want to buy health insurance, the cost per person will obviously be higher than what a group of 1,000 people would pay.

if's are for philosophers

here in america, obamacare CUTS MEDICARE a full HALF TRILLION DOLLARS while exapanding its already enervated enrollment, entirely reliant upon it, by millions

Capitol Briefing - Senate votes to keep Medicare cuts

it adds millions more to medicaid, unfunded, burdening our already bankrupt state budgets by 200B

Governors balk over what healthcare bill will cost states - The Boston Globe

bottom line---obamacare's a bust
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

Most recent polls I've seen have concluded that most Americans either support the law, or oppose it on the grounds that it didn't go far enough.

if obama believed that he'd have prioritized his health care bill in his sotu ABOVE race to the top and credit cards

he'd have spoken AFFIRMATIVELY about his signature piece

he didn't

he musta read the polls published november 3
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

They don't care. That should be obvious from the last 2 years.

Oh I disagree, during the 8 years of Bush, his administration would give the American people a slight nudge every once in a while. But never fully awakened them. No Obama on the other hand .. should be thanked. He rousted them, woke them completely up. After waking them, he has gotten them fighting mad..... and I think the 2010 elections kinda proves that point well. The people do care ….... well except for those on the extreme left … and they aren't happy because of his failures to the extreme
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

I'm hoping that's exactly what happens, that it dies from it's own weight. That relieves the Congress from having to make any rash decisions.

And hurts the people. It is disgusting to me that people in this country do not want to help folks via healthcare. Disgusting!
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

And hurts the people. It is disgusting to me that people in this country do not want to help folks via healthcare. Disgusting!


I'm sorry you feel that way, because I think your thinking is somewhat flawed, I truly believe that folks on both sides agree healthcare “reform” is needed, they are disagreeing on what has been enacted into law, as being a good or bad program.

In my opinion, it's a terrible bill that has been passed. I would feel that way about any bill passed that ignores the simple fact that 70% of people that have health insurance is happy with it. I don't care if the bill is by republican's or democrat's when you ignore 70% of the people to take care of others it's wrong.

Do you realize, that for the cost of this bill, the government could purchase every uninsured person in this country a $5.000 deductible policy and save money? You're next argument would be they can't afford $5,000 dollars.... and I would say in many instances you are right, but look at the flip side of the coin, the doctors … the hospitals .. and everyone else involved in health care, would take only a $5,000 hit on any person, if there total bill happened to run into hundreds of thousands of dollars, wouldn't the health care industry be in better shape writing off $5,000 then the entire bill ?? now multiply this times the number of times it happens, then consider the savings to health care, could this not help drive down health care costs ?

Right now we have some of the best hospitals, doctors and technology in the world, we should be proud of what we have, while realizing that we have problems, I just happen to be one that don't think we need to overhaul our entire system of health care to fix the problems we have in it. Thing like cutting waste and fraud out of the Medicare system would help, tort reform, allowing companies to sell nationwide are all things that would help, not cure .. but help, those things could have been done quickly, with support from both sides, would have cost no one anything, and would have started the process … What is wrong with starting with simple things that everyone can agree on.... that can do nothing but help?
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

Do you realize, that for the cost of this bill, the government could purchase every uninsured person in this country a $5.000 deductible policy and save money?

That's essentially what the public option was. The Republicans and conservative Democrats blocked it. I agree, a simple solution like that would save a lot of money.
 
enjoy it while it lasts...supreme court here we come

Yep it's going there, but I wouldn't seem so sure, remember the court is still 5 conservative to 4 liberal ... going to be very close any way you look at it. I know I wouldn't put money on which way they rule.
 
Who... conservative pundits on TV (who already have good coverage)

Nope for us that believe and follow the Consutution.
 
Yep it's going there, but I wouldn't seem so sure, remember the court is still 5 conservative to 4 liberal ... going to be very close any way you look at it. I know I wouldn't put money on which way they rule.

Good, then all mandates will be thrown out. We'll no longer have to buy auto insurance. Perhaps we'll no longer have to pay income tax.
 
Good, then all mandates will be thrown out. We'll no longer have to buy auto insurance. Perhaps we'll no longer have to pay income tax.

Perhaps you can show me where the federal government forces you to buy auto insurance. I believe that is mandated by the states. Is it not?

As for the federal income tax, can you tell me what you are purchasing with that ?

I'm certainly not a legal scholar, but even to me it seem an over reach of our governments power to force someone to buy anything. What would be next, cars? After all we have an financial stake in two auto companies, so would it be a reach, to be told that you must buy a car from one of them, after all that would be in the interest of the US wouldn't it?
 
Nope for us that believe and follow the Consutution.

So, we go back to paying for the freeloaders who show up at the ER w/o coverage?

He's an activist judge alright, but for what side.
 
Perhaps you can show me where the federal government forces you to buy auto insurance. I believe that is mandated by the states. Is it not?

Um... if it's unconstitutional for the Fed, it's unconstitutional for the states. State law can not violate the U.S. Constitution.

As for the federal income tax, can you tell me what you are purchasing with that ?

Federal services. And I said perhaps. A broader reading of the judges decision, and blamo... no IRS.

I'm certainly not a legal scholar, but even to me it seem an over reach of our governments power to force someone to buy anything. What would be next, cars? After all we have an financial stake in two auto companies, so would it be a reach, to be told that you must buy a car from one of them, after all that would be in the interest of the US wouldn't it?

No one's forcing you to buy, just pay the relatively small fee to cover your care should you turn up in the ER.

But if you don't pay income tax, you go to jail. That feels like force.
 
Good, then all mandates will be thrown out. We'll no longer have to buy auto insurance. Perhaps we'll no longer have to pay income tax.

the complete fallacy of that argument has been explained many times on this board, but I'm not at all surprised you'd revert to using it.

You have a CHOICE about driving... drive or dont.

There is no CHOICE about breathing.
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

600,000 in my county alone was Illegal aliens. How are the costs in MA for universal healthcare? Nothing in this bill lowers costs, improves quality, or assures there are enough doctors. If your state wants to do it, then let the people decide but to have a program run by the Federal Govt. and forcing people to buy insurance is a violation of individual freedoms.

Yeah, I'm sure all unpaid ER bills, which are passed on to the tax payer, are due to illegal aliens. "Forcing" people to buy insurance is not a violation of the Constitution. Obama's people are betting that the commerce cause covers them. The SCOTUS will decide.


I didn't learn conservative ideology in civics class but did learn the role of the Federal Govt. and the three branches. I didn't see healthcare anywhere in the Constitution as a mandate.

Commerce clause.


There you go again so much faith in the Federal Govt. that has given us a 14.1 trillion dollar debt. There is no evidence that this bill will make things better just your opinion. By the way Rasmussan says you are wrong, healthcare is not supported by the majority in this country nor is a single payer system.

There you go again acting like your right-wing ideology is the only thing that matters. I do believe that the gov't plays an important role in our lives. It is not just my opinion that the HC law is making things better for some Americans. It is also the opinions of those who have taken advantage of the provisions that are already in place.

I couldn't care less what Rasmussen says. Though every conservative loves to use Rasmussen, they're unreliable. When every other poll has Obama's approval numbers at or over 50%, Rasmussen has him barely breaking 45%. Anyway, I don't know why you're bringing them up. First of all, I never said that a majority of Americans support single payer. Try to pay attention. What I said is that a majority of Americans support the public option. That is a fact. Look at any poll. Even your beloved Rasmussen shows support for the public option.

[A] national survey released this afternoon by CNN/Opinion ... finds 61% of Americans in favor of a government-run health insurance plan to compete with private insurance companies.

RealClearPolitics - Politics Nation - CNN Poll: 61% Favor Public Option

a USA Today/Gallup poll, 52 percent of those surveyed say they want a public option in health-care coverage.

USA Today: 52% Still Want Public Option in Health Care « SpeakEasy

The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey shows that 57% oppose the plan if it doesn't include a government-run health insurance plan to compete with private insurers.

Without Public Option, Enthusiasm for Health Care Reform, Especially Among Democrats, Collapses - Rasmussen Reports™


So we need Obamacare to implement what is in place right now? You think there are enough kids on their parents program to justify the costs? Affordable drugs came from the Bush Medicare program not Obamacare. Not sure where you are getting your information but you are out of your league here.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Affordable drugs came from Bush? I guess that's why drugs are still expensive. But Bush did add a lot of money to the deficit with his unfunded plan. Ask the seniors who have received their $250 checks for prescriptions thanks to the new HC law. And what costs will come from children staying on their parents' health plans?

I'm out of my league? That's grand coming from someone who doesn't even know that provisions of the HC law have gone into effect. I'll tell you what, genius, get back to me when you have a clue.
 
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Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

liberals often believe if something is "good" then it has to be constitutional

Conservatives often believe that if they don't like something, it must be unconstitutional.
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

That's essentially what the public option was. The Republicans and conservative Democrats blocked it. I agree, a simple solution like that would save a lot of money.

It would not save money it would cost money. Tax payers would end up paying more. Look at England that can no longer pay for their government health care. Government does never lower the cost of anything
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

I have to laugh. CC didn't believe me when I said that lefties actually argued that there were people left dying in the streets under the current health care system. I'll have to show him this. Thanks.:2wave:

I have to laugh whenever I see another conservative denying that people are denied life-saving procedures because they either don't have health insurance or their insurers won't cover the procedure. Conservatives seem to think that everything is just fine. I guess that's why Republicans did nothing to fix the HC system during all of those years that they controlled both houses of Congress and the White House.
 
Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

Conservatives often believe that if they don't like something, it must be unconstitutional.

In your opinion, was the invasion of Iraq constitutional?
 
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