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Thread: Obama Health-Care Reform Act Ruled Unconstitutional(edited)

  1. #171
    Educator Sgt Meowenstein's Avatar
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    600,000 in my county alone was Illegal aliens. How are the costs in MA for universal healthcare? Nothing in this bill lowers costs, improves quality, or assures there are enough doctors. If your state wants to do it, then let the people decide but to have a program run by the Federal Govt. and forcing people to buy insurance is a violation of individual freedoms.
    Yeah, I'm sure all unpaid ER bills, which are passed on to the tax payer, are due to illegal aliens. "Forcing" people to buy insurance is not a violation of the Constitution. Obama's people are betting that the commerce cause covers them. The SCOTUS will decide.


    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    I didn't learn conservative ideology in civics class but did learn the role of the Federal Govt. and the three branches. I didn't see healthcare anywhere in the Constitution as a mandate.
    Commerce clause.


    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    There you go again so much faith in the Federal Govt. that has given us a 14.1 trillion dollar debt. There is no evidence that this bill will make things better just your opinion. By the way Rasmussan says you are wrong, healthcare is not supported by the majority in this country nor is a single payer system.
    There you go again acting like your right-wing ideology is the only thing that matters. I do believe that the gov't plays an important role in our lives. It is not just my opinion that the HC law is making things better for some Americans. It is also the opinions of those who have taken advantage of the provisions that are already in place.

    I couldn't care less what Rasmussen says. Though every conservative loves to use Rasmussen, they're unreliable. When every other poll has Obama's approval numbers at or over 50%, Rasmussen has him barely breaking 45%. Anyway, I don't know why you're bringing them up. First of all, I never said that a majority of Americans support single payer. Try to pay attention. What I said is that a majority of Americans support the public option. That is a fact. Look at any poll. Even your beloved Rasmussen shows support for the public option.

    [A] national survey released this afternoon by CNN/Opinion ... finds 61% of Americans in favor of a government-run health insurance plan to compete with private insurance companies.

    RealClearPolitics - Politics Nation - CNN Poll: 61% Favor Public Option
    a USA Today/Gallup poll, 52 percent of those surveyed say they want a public option in health-care coverage.

    USA Today: 52% Still Want Public Option in Health Care SpeakEasy
    The latest Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey shows that 57% oppose the plan if it doesn't include a government-run health insurance plan to compete with private insurers.

    Without Public Option, Enthusiasm for Health Care Reform, Especially Among Democrats, Collapses - Rasmussen Reports™

    Quote Originally Posted by Conservative View Post
    So we need Obamacare to implement what is in place right now? You think there are enough kids on their parents program to justify the costs? Affordable drugs came from the Bush Medicare program not Obamacare. Not sure where you are getting your information but you are out of your league here.
    BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA. Affordable drugs came from Bush? I guess that's why drugs are still expensive. But Bush did add a lot of money to the deficit with his unfunded plan. Ask the seniors who have received their $250 checks for prescriptions thanks to the new HC law. And what costs will come from children staying on their parents' health plans?

    I'm out of my league? That's grand coming from someone who doesn't even know that provisions of the HC law have gone into effect. I'll tell you what, genius, get back to me when you have a clue.
    Last edited by Sgt Meowenstein; 02-01-11 at 09:35 AM.

  2. #172
    Educator Sgt Meowenstein's Avatar
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    liberals often believe if something is "good" then it has to be constitutional
    Conservatives often believe that if they don't like something, it must be unconstitutional.

  3. #173
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar View Post
    That's essentially what the public option was. The Republicans and conservative Democrats blocked it. I agree, a simple solution like that would save a lot of money.
    It would not save money it would cost money. Tax payers would end up paying more. Look at England that can no longer pay for their government health care. Government does never lower the cost of anything

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    Educator Sgt Meowenstein's Avatar
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    I have to laugh. CC didn't believe me when I said that lefties actually argued that there were people left dying in the streets under the current health care system. I'll have to show him this. Thanks.
    I have to laugh whenever I see another conservative denying that people are denied life-saving procedures because they either don't have health insurance or their insurers won't cover the procedure. Conservatives seem to think that everything is just fine. I guess that's why Republicans did nothing to fix the HC system during all of those years that they controlled both houses of Congress and the White House.

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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Meowenstein View Post
    Conservatives often believe that if they don't like something, it must be unconstitutional.
    In your opinion, was the invasion of Iraq constitutional?
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  6. #176
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Meowenstein View Post
    Yeah, I'm sure all unpaid ER bills, which are passed on to the tax payer, are due to illegal aliens. "Forcing" people to buy insurance is not a violation of the Constitution. Obama's people are betting that the commerce cause covers them. The SCOTUS will decide.
    Is this unconstitutional?

    Bill would require all S.D. citizens to buy a gun | The Argus Leader | argusleader.com
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    In your opinion, was the invasion of Iraq constitutional?
    It was approved by Congress; so, yes. But that doesn't mean that it was a just war. See the difference? I don 't like the war, but I don't think that it was unconstitutional. Conservatives call anything that they don't like 'unconstitutional', while simultaneously trying to change the Constitution to suit their ideology.


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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    I'm not playing your game. I made my point. You disagree? Good for you.


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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Quote Originally Posted by Sgt Meowenstein View Post
    I'm not playing your game. I made my point. You disagree? Good for you.
    I accept your surrender.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

  10. #180
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    Re: Obamacare Unconstitutional

    Kandahar;1059256943]Doesn't change the fact that the government can and has provided health care programs. They are entirely within the scope of the federal government's powers.
    Providing it and mandating it are two different issues.


    Most recent polls I've seen have concluded that most Americans either support the law, or oppose it on the grounds that it didn't go far enough. In any case, there certainly isn't the "overwhelming opposition" you claim. The numbers are fairly close.
    Not according to the lasted Rasumussen Poll regarding repeal. Suggest you look it up.


    I'd love to have a government plan. The government does not have a financial incentive to screw me like a for-profit health insurer does.
    Right, the govt. just screws you to retain power and keep you dependent. We havea 14.1 trillion dollar debt, that is screwing you if you are a taxpayer.


    And some cannot get insurance because they have a preexisting condition. Or they're stuck in a job that they can't leave because they'd lose their health insurance. And Medicaid does not begin to cover the health care needs of low-income people.
    So we need Obamacare to cover pre-existing conditions? Why is healthcare insurance someone else's responsibility? You still haven't answered that question nor have you told me how this healthcare bill lowers costs, improves quality, and adds hospitals and doctors?


    Considering just about every other developed country in the world has far MORE government regulation of health insurers than we do, and far lower costs than we do, I'd say that's highly unlikely.
    Proof? That is your opinion, suggest doing some research and identifying all the costs before proposing massive expansion of the govt.


    OK, maybe that adds a few percent to total health care costs.
    Have you checked what healthcare companies make in terms of profit percentages since percentages mean so much to you?


    OK, that adds maybe a few more percent. Keep going. Our health care costs per capita are nearly 50% above the next-highest nations (Switzerland & France).

    We have 309 million Americans and liberals love to compare per capita, on a percentage basis of GDP because for some reason that is supposed to mean something. With that "big" difference explain to me why the life expectency is just as high in this country as those other countries?



    How does that add to our health care costs? If anything, that's a DRAG on health care costs because it prevents people from getting new and expensive treatments.
    You have given us no justification for someone else paying for your health insurance.


    You just trotted out a list of things you don't like about health care costs, without even bothering to assess how they impact cost. :roll
    Everything I listed affects costs and until they are addressed your massive expansion of the govt. is unjustified. Govt. is ill equiped to handle anything of this size thus it is a state and local responsibility. You cannot seem to sell it in the states so you want the govt. to force upon everyone else something YOU think is necessary. Where do the govt. mandates stop in a govt. based upon individual freedoms and a small central govt. model? 14.1 trillion dollar debt later with most of that due to govt. social engineering.

    Nice try, now offer a program that reduces costs, increases quality, and quantity.

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