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Thread: White House to Push Gun Control

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Well hang on to your hat, then, because a whole lot of de-regulation is probably on the way.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Well hang on to your hat, then, because a whole lot of de-regulation is probably on the way.
    we'll see. and if it does, and we see the same tyupe of effect that deregulation had on the economy, it'll swing back the other way. As I've said, I have no emotional attachment to a tool. This argument is not a new one. we've all been down these roads before.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  3. #693
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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    we'll see. and if it does, and we see the same tyupe of effect that deregulation had on the economy, it'll swing back the other way. As I've said, I have no emotional attachment to a tool. This argument is not a new one. we've all been down these roads before.
    Violent crime in the USA has been falling for a long time, at the same time as gun ownership has increased...

    When considering 5- and 10-year trends, the 2009 estimated violent crime total was
    5.2 percent below the 2005 level and 7.5 percent below the 2000 level.
    Violent Crime - Crime in the United States 2009
    Coinciding with a surge in gun purchases that began shortly before the 2008 elections, violent crime decreased six percent between 2008 and 2009, including an eight percent decrease in murder and a nine percent decrease in robbery.1 Since 1991, when violent crime peaked, it has decreased 43 percent to a 35-year low. Murder has fallen 49 percent to a 45-year low.2 At the same time, the number of guns that Americans own has risen by about 90 million.
    Over the last quarter-century, many federal, state and local gun control laws have been eliminated or made less restrictive. The federal “assault weapon” ban, upon which gun control supporters claimed public safety hinged, expired in 2004 and the murder rate has since dropped 10 percent. The federal handgun waiting period, for years the centerpiece of gun control supporters’ agenda, expired in 1998, in favor of the NRA-supported national Instant Check, and the murder rate has since dropped 21 percent.
    NRA-ILA :: More Guns, Less Crime Again

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    Violent crime in the USA has been falling for a long time, at the same time as gun ownership has increased...



    Violent Crime - Crime in the United States 2009




    NRA-ILA :: More Guns, Less Crime Again
    have you ever heard of the causal relationship fallacy? There may be no connection whatsoever between the two things. I suspect there isn't. but, in any case, you need more evidence than a time line.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    have you ever heard of the causal relationship fallacy? There may be no connection whatsoever between the two things. I suspect there isn't. but, in any case, you need more evidence than a time line.

    I am perfectly aware of that. My point is that your implication that relaxing gun regulations would result in negative outcomes have not been shown to be probable, and that existing data indicates that the results would probably be positive, or at worst no-change.

    Fiddling While Rome Burns
    ISIS: Carthago Delenda Est
    "I used to roll the dice; see the fear in my enemies' eyes... listen as the crowd would sing, 'now the old king is dead, Long Live the King.'.."

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    the problem people like Boo and other gun haters have is that they only have one possible argument supporting gun restrictions-that such laws will objectively make us safer. There is absolutely no other argument that flies on this subject for their side. we on the other hand have many arguments-the vast majority are not defeated even if the gun haters could prove more restrictions actually made society safer.

    and since the gun haters have never come close to meeting their burden, their position fails



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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Goshin View Post
    I am perfectly aware of that. My point is that your implication that relaxing gun regulations would result in negative outcomes have not been shown to be probable, and that existing data indicates that the results would probably be positive, or at worst no-change.
    I don't think I said that. But I did see someone once make the same causal relationship error when he noted crime went down after the Brady bill. Crime is more complicated than gun laws alone. And I'm not sure the data tells us anything at all. The fact is a regulation has be judged on it's merit, the logic behind it. This is the same with all regulations. There is nothing different as it relates to gun regulations. And when we measure effectieness, we have to define the purpose accurately, and actually show a causal relationship.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    the problem people like Boo and other gun haters have is that they only have one possible argument supporting gun restrictions-that such laws will objectively make us safer. There is absolutely no other argument that flies on this subject for their side. we on the other hand have many arguments-the vast majority are not defeated even if the gun haters could prove more restrictions actually made society safer.

    and since the gun haters have never come close to meeting their burden, their position fails
    Not a gun hater. I've actually been know to hunt with one. But, hey, don't let a good false sterotype slow you down.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not a gun hater. I've actually been know to hunt with one. But, hey, don't let a good false sterotype slow you down.
    I'm a shooter, hunter and reloader who sees America's handgun fetish as a cruel fascination with a phallic symbol that unjustifiably kills thousands of its children annually.

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    Re: White House to Push Gun Control

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    Not a gun hater. I've actually been know to hunt with one. But, hey, don't let a good false sterotype slow you down.
    your evasive little game has been seen by many

    I have been involved in this issue both as an interested amateur and a well known professional for 35 years. I know all the arguments, facades, evasions and excuses



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