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Riots erupt in Egypt as protesters demand end to Mubarak regime

apdst said:
That's great! I love it!

By that logic, we should keep propping up Mubarack. :rofl
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No, the mistake was ever propping up Mubarak to begin with. Same mistake we made in our support of Saddam in the 80's when he was at his murderous worst.
 
apdst said:
The MB takeover of the Egyptian government is going to just awesome!
This cat's awesome!
Is this all that democracy and human rights we've been hearing about?
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It is simply amazing to me how some people in the most powerful country on the planet can be so fearful.
 
Catawba said:
It is simply amazing to me how some people in the most powerful country on the planet can be so fearful.
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Americans are fearful??

That's what others have thought as well, until the Americans turned their attention on them.

You probably have the Americans confused with someone else.
 
 
 
Grant said:
Americans are fearful??
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Just look at the reaction of some to the population of Egypt rising up against an American supported dictatorship.

That's what others have thought as well, until the Americans turned their attention on them.
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That's what fearful people do, they blindly strike out. What I don't understand is why the bully on the block with all the marbles is so frightened.

You probably have the Americans confused with someone else.
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No, its America, we spend more than the rest of the world combined on our military and many of us are still frightened little children it seems. Why is that?
 
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apdst said:
I'm on the side of democracy and human rights. I'm not skeered.
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Than deal with the march toward democracy that is happening in Egypt and stop and crying about the Muslim minority there.
 
Catawba said:
Than deal with the march toward democracy that is happening in Egypt
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I'll deal with the march toward democracy in Egypt when it happens. Until then, I'm not going to act all impressed, over nothing.

stop and crying about the Muslim minority there.
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Muslim minority? :lamo
 
Catawba said:
Let's review. We invade and militarily occupy a country that is of no threat to us, destabilizing the government that prevented a civil war in the country, killing those that tried to defend their country against a foreign occupation, a civil war breaks out between the warring factions that the previous government kept in check, but this all the Iraqis fault?

Is that your reasoning?
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We invade and militarily occupy a country as a humanitarian intervention, a just war according to Just War Theory. We intentionally removed the government to build a democracy. This previous government prevented strife between the main religious groups with the heel of his boot, not something to be admired. Careful you don't glorify the insurgents as "defending their country" as they slaughtered tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis; they are terrorists. A civil war breaks out, with militias from both sides, which we STOP. I wouldn't say that this is all the Iraqis fault, as we do share some responsibility for destabilizing the country as we removed the existing power structure, but the Iraqi insurgents are the ones killing the majority of their fellow Iraqis, not us. Your claim that we are responsible for killing tens of thousands of Iraqis is so far off the mark and you do it intentionally to place blame on our actions. You are a reprobate.
 
apdst said:
Muslim minority?
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"Egyptian analyst Mustafa Abulhimal says this is not the Muslim Brotherhood's revolution.

"The Muslim Brotherhood are not behind the organization of the protests," he said. "The Muslim Brotherhood are not inspiring the protests in the street. The Muslim Brotherhood are a small minority among those who are out on the street," he said.
Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood: A force to be feared? - CNN
 
reefedjib said:
We invade and militarily occupy a country as a humanitarian intervention, a just war according to Just War Theory.
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We did no such thing, the war was sold to the American people as Iraq being a threat.

We intentionally removed the government to build a democracy
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.

We intentionally removed a government that blocked Western oil from the largest oil reserves on the planet.


This previous government prevented strife between the main religious groups with the heel of his boot, not something to be admired
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.

Same way it did when we were his alley in the 80's so evidently we didn't have a problem with that.

Careful you don't glorify the insurgents as "defending their country" as they slaughtered tens of thousands of innocent Iraqis; they are terrorists.
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We unleashed them, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen. Any Iraqi we killed that fought against our invasion, we just call insurgents to justify our killing.

A civil war breaks out, with militias from both sides, which we STOP
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Our bungle, allowed the civil war to resume, and you want to take credit for stopping it? So we are now doing the same thing as Saddam did at a the cost of a trillion dollars and thousands of lives we have sacrificed for something Saddam was already doing without our support. Good plan!

I wouldn't say that this is all the Iraqis fault, as we do share some responsibility for destabilizing the country as we removed the existing power structure,
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Ya think!

but the Iraqi insurgents are the ones killing the majority of their fellow Iraqis, not us
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We allowed the insurgents in!

Your claim that we are responsible for killing tens of thousands of Iraqis is so far off the mark and you do it intentionally to place blame on our actions. You are a reprobate.
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I'm a reprobate for questioning an immoral act of aggression to people that were not a threat to us?
 
Catawba said:
"Egyptian analyst Mustafa Abulhimal says this is not the Muslim Brotherhood's revolution.

"The Muslim Brotherhood are not behind the organization of the protests," he said. "The Muslim Brotherhood are not inspiring the protests in the street. The Muslim Brotherhood are a small minority among those who are out on the street," he said.
Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood: A force to be feared? - CNN
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They may not be inspiring the protests, but they're surely taking advantage of the political situation.
 
Catawba said:
Just look at the reaction of some to the population of Egypt rising up against an American supported dictatorship.
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I'm seeing a reaction from countries all over the world, and fear is not among them. Concern perhaps, but that's as far as it goes. The Americans have no reason to be fearful, and aren't.
That's what fearful people do, they blindly strike out. What I don't understand is why the bully on the block with all the marbles is so frightened.
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Obama is making inappropriate comments that could be construed as "wildly striking out" and should have waited until the dust settled before he gets drawn into the conflict but thats just dumbness on his part, not fear.
No, its America, we spend more than the rest of the world combined on our military and many of us are still frightened little children it seems. Why is that?
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It might be best to speak for yourself here. If you are afraid , what is it you're afraid of?
 
apdst said:
They may not be inspiring the protests, but they're surely taking advantage of the political situation.
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As they have been locked out of the political process they would be fools not to.
 
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Grant said:
You're not an American.

That's a British thing.
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Its a moral thing, the British just happen to be a bit more moral than our country as a whole.
 
Grant said:
I'm seeing a reaction from countries all over the world, and fear is not among them. Concern perhaps, but that's as far as it goes. The Americans have no reason to be fearful, and aren't.
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Glad to hear that, it sure sounds like fear.

Obama is making inappropriate comments that could be construed as "wildly striking out" and should have waited until the dust settled before he gets drawn into the conflict but thats just dumbness on his part, not fear.
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What inappropriate comments?
 
Catawba said:
As they have been locked out of the political process the would be fools not to.
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From their perspecctive, that's true. However, let us not deny that they are going to hold a majority of the stroke, when the new government is created.
 
Catawba said:
We did no such thing, the war was sold to the American people as Iraq being a threat.
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That may have been the way it was sold, but that was not the core justification. It was a Just War.

We intentionally removed a government that blocked Western oil from the largest oil reserves on the planet.
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We intentionally removed a government that enslaved its population. We freed the people from subjugation.

Same way it did when we were his alley in the 80's so evidently we didn't have a problem with that.
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We did not have a problem providing support to dictators to get oil. Hopefully that has changed.

We unleashed them, if you can't take the heat, stay out of the kitchen.
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We did not unleash them. They chose to fight us.

Any Iraqi we killed that fought against our invasion, we just call insurgents to justify our killing.
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We were the approved occupying power. They instituted the violence against us.

Our bungle, allowed the civil war to resume, and you want to take credit for stopping it?
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We were not fighting a counterinsurgency, even though one developed. We corrected that mistake and protected the population. This stopped the civil war. Absolutely we take credit for stopping it.

So we are now doing the same thing as Saddam did at a the cost of a trillion dollars and thousands of lives we have sacrificed for something Saddam was already doing without our support. Good plan!
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Were we suppressing the opposition with a secret police, torture and murder? I don't think so.

Ya think!
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Yes. We could have anticipated it better. We disbanded the Army as it was a force of Sunni power, which had to be broken for true democracy to form.

We allowed the insurgents in!
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How did we do that!? We didn't have control over the border and even if we had there are ways to smuggle past. It is an impossible job keeping them out. We won't be blamed for that.

I'm a reprobate for questioning an immoral act of aggression to people that were not a threat to us?
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It was NOT an immoral act of aggression.

Yes, you are a reprobate for not merely assuming the worst on our part, but for talking about it in ways that assigns blame to us for things we are not to blame for, like killing tens of thousands of Iraqis.
 
apdst said:
From their perspecctive, that's true. However, let us not deny that they are going to hold a majority of the stroke, when the new government is created.
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That's democracy for ya!
 
There seems to be a long running discussion-in-discussion about the reasons for the Iraq War.
It's main justification, and Casus belli was Saddam having WMD.
A credible but, as it turned out, wrong one.

But probably the main accusation against Bush (and the neocons) was that they were trying to export/"impose democracy".
And that WAS one of the objectives.

So Credit as well as blame must be given by war opponents for any success in Iraq and at least to some degree, the further spread of democracy, however clumsily. Yes, it was at horrendous cost to us in Lives and Treasure.
 
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