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Thread: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    I wasn't posting about anything other than the topic, until you and Doc jumped on the bandwagon. Then, you made it all about me.
    This thread is about David Axelrod? This thread is about Bart Stepak? This thread is about prosecuting the Obama administration?

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by StillBallin75 View Post
    Isn't that what AWOL means?
    No. It basically means that you can't be absent without permission from someone with the authority to give that permission. "Leave", isn't restricted to the 30 days of annual leave that everyone in the service receives.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Catz Part Deux View Post
    This thread is about David Axelrod? This thread is about Bart Stepak? This thread is about prosecuting the Obama administration?
    It sure as hell ain't about APDST. I think we can all agree on that.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by Cole View Post
    Agree with your point. Either enforce the laws or get rid of (or revise) the ones that are outdated.

    But before pursuing prosecutions, it would be appropriate to determine if some of this behavior has just become business as usual in Washington (suspicions lean that is the case).

    Am all for cleaning things up moving forward. Not so much for putting people in jail just because they happened to be the most recent ones in a behavior pattern that has been going on for decades.


    .
    Thank you for your post. And yes, Conservatives (those that are left) strongly believe in accountability. After all, if we forget what Bush did, then we are enabling Obama and future presidents to do the same.

    And to American - This is not about not being able to move on. This is about keeping our system safe for Democracy. Yes, I bash Bush. I bash Obama too. I bash anyone who disregards our forefathers. If you weren't so busy acting like a troll all the time, you would see that.
    The ghost of Jack Kevorkian for President's Physician: 2016

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    ... According to the report, the White House improperly orchestrated the use of assets throughout the government to help key congressional allies as the voting drew near, including arranging more than 100 ostensibly official appearances by top appointees in battleground states such as Pennsylvania, New Mexico, Ohio, Kentucky, Indiana and Connecticut.
    This federally funded travel was organized, approved and closely tracked by Bush's political office, the Office of Special Counsel found, describing the activity as leading to the illegal diversion of federal funds and workers' time.

    At one point in 2006, it disclosed, operatives employed by the Republican National Committee moved into White House quarters where they worked in tandem with the political-office staff to coordinate the campaign.

    While White House officials may legally pursue close political contact with outsiders, the report said, "the systematic, partisan political activity described in this report, including strategically supplying targeted candidates with administration support to secure electoral gains, goes far beyond a need for political information [meant] to effectively advise the president." ...
    the dicknbush regime played in the gray area of the hatch act
    it would be pointless to seek prosecution as the only ones who would be nailed would be the non-political civil servants who were doing as they were instructed by their supervisors - the political appointees - who, as you will find below, enjoy a special dispensation relative to their partisan political involvement, and that any abuse is punishable by the president alone

    ... Occasionally, some of the estimated 100,000 documents reviewed by the counsel's office described the need for these trips to be reimbursed by political funds, but no evidence could be found that they were. ...
    here, is the only overt violation, where the internal records confirm reimbursement monies were due from the campaign because of political activities engaged, and those monies were never paid
    the penalty should be to require payment of the amounts reflected by those administration documents

    The Hatch Act: An Overview -- GovExec.com
    ... Political appointees operate under the same rules with some exceptions. They are allowed to engage in political activity while on duty, in government buildings, wearing official uniforms or insignias, or using government vehicles, provided their actions don't amount to coercive use of the office to which they have been appointed. They cannot pay for political activities with taxpayer dollars, however. ...
    in reading this thread it appears many are unfamiliar with the latitude provided to political appointees to engage in partisan political activities. they can - and do - campaign while being paid a federal salary, during work hours, from the federal work place
    and that is acceptable under the law, as it is presently constructed. it gives a huge advantage to the incumbent
    to have the taxpayer pay for their partisan politicking, all the political appointee has to do is schedule an official federal business activity where they want to go and federal travel dollars pay for it. that can be a five minute observation followed by travel to a partisan event. because they conducted official business on the trip they have satisfied the provisions of the law
    ... The penalties for political appointees are less clear because OSC refers cases to the president, who can decide whether to pursue disciplinary action. ...
    notice that the office of special counsel, ordinarily charged with prosecuting hatch act violations, can only make recommendations to the president when the violation pertains to a political appointee ... someone that president appointed

    i imagine Obama could now be the one to initiate prosecution, but we see he has been inclined to allow the past regime to skate on other matters which are substantially more important
    can't imagine that he would pursue this
    the only ones who would be hurt are the civil servants - the career employees who were not politically appointed and who do not receive special hatch act dispensations. their violations would have been likely due to their following the orders of the political appointee. how fair would it be to prosecute them for following orders?
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    the dicknbush regime played in the gray area of the hatch act
    it would be pointless to seek prosecution as the only ones who would be nailed would be the non-political civil servants who were doing as they were instructed by their supervisors - the political appointees - who, as you will find below, enjoy a special dispensation relative to their partisan political involvement, and that any abuse is punishable by the president alone


    here, is the only overt violation, where the internal records confirm reimbursement monies were due from the campaign because of political activities engaged, and those monies were never paid
    the penalty should be to require payment of the amounts reflected by those administration documents

    The Hatch Act: An Overview -- GovExec.com

    in reading this thread it appears many are unfamiliar with the latitude provided to political appointees to engage in partisan political activities. they can - and do - campaign while being paid a federal salary, during work hours, from the federal work place
    and that is acceptable under the law, as it is presently constructed. it gives a huge advantage to the incumbent
    to have the taxpayer pay for their partisan politicking, all the political appointee has to do is schedule an official federal business activity where they want to go and federal travel dollars pay for it. that can be a five minute observation followed by travel to a partisan event. because they conducted official business on the trip they have satisfied the provisions of the law

    notice that the office of special counsel, ordinarily charged with prosecuting hatch act violations, can only make recommendations to the president when the violation pertains to a political appointee ... someone that president appointed

    i imagine Obama could now be the one to initiate prosecution, but we see he has been inclined to allow the past regime to skate on other matters which are substantially more important
    can't imagine that he would pursue this
    the only ones who would be hurt are the civil servants - the career employees who were not politically appointed and who do not receive special hatch act dispensations. their violations would have been likely due to their following the orders of the political appointee. how fair would it be to prosecute them for following orders?
    Political appointees are exempted from the Hatch Act.

    Section 7324 of The Hatch Act provides an exemption to the ban on political activities to:

    * (i) an employee paid from an appropriation for the Executive Office of the President; or

    * (ii) an employee appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate, whose position is located within the United States, who determines policies to be pursued by the United States in the nationwide administration of Federal laws.

    Hatch Act of 1939 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    It's the point I've been making all along. Some folks are so blind with their hatred for Bush, they refuse to see the facts.

    That's why I mentioned Axlerod and Emanual.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Political appointees are exempted from the Hatch Act.



    It's the point I've been making all along. Some folks are so blind with their hatred for Bush, they refuse to see the facts.

    That's why I mentioned Axlerod and Emanual.
    nope
    read it again
    the political appointees are still subject to the hatch act
    but they are exempt from some of its prohibitions
    i previously offered a cite which provides an overview of the hatch act; you are encouraged to read it
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    nope
    read it again
    the political appointees are still subject to the hatch act
    but they are exempt from some of its prohibitions
    i previously offered a cite which provides an overview of the hatch act; you are encouraged to read it
    Annnnd, I provided the actual text of the bill.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by apdst View Post
    Annnnd, I provided the actual text of the bill.
    and you still managed to misunderstand what was stated
    shock [/sarcasm]
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

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    Re: Bush officials violated Hatch Act, agency concludes

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    and you still managed to misunderstand what was stated
    shock [/sarcasm]
    I'll ignore the personal attack, because that was expected and post this, from a government website on, "less restricted", personel by the Hatch Act.

    The Hatch Act prohibits Less Restricted employees from:

    * using their official authority or influence to interfere with or affect the result of an election;

    * knowingly soliciting, accepting, or receiving a political contribution from any person (this may be done in certain limited situations by federal labor or other employee organizations);

    * knowingly soliciting or discouraging the participation in any political activity of anyone who has business pending before their employing agency;

    * being candidates for public office in partisan political elections; or

    * engaging in political activity while:

    * on duty;

    * in a government office;

    * wearing an official uniform; or

    * using a government vehicle

    Information on Hatch Act
    The question to the, "Bush is a definite criminal", folks; which one of Bush's people violated these prohibitions, what did they do and show us where Bush ordered them to do so? Thanks in advance.
    Quote Originally Posted by Top Cat View Post
    At least Bill saved his transgressions for grown women. Not suggesting what he did was OK. But he didn't chase 14 year olds.

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