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Thread: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

  1. #61
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Yeah, Centrist, because you say so there is no argument that is a violation... just after I specifically asked you to avoid this perpetuating stalemate inducing **** and put forth a real argument. Guy, I'm aiming that at you since you tried to shift the goalposts from my challenging you to you challenging me without attempting to counter with argument. >_<

    Alright, you want an argument? How about the fact that cops have come out to say they would be investigated, fired, maybe arrested if they did what the TSA was doing with regards to the patdowns? How about that these federal agents can digitally strip search when real cops can't physically strip search us under most circumstances [not even in a courthouse]?


    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    ...and thats fine and I agree with some of that but the TSA policies do NOT violate the constitution, there is no FORCE
    And again, PROVE IT.

    Don't just say "it isn't" over and over
    Don't shift the goal posts, dodge the question

    Just try to prove your point and make an argument that is worth responding to.
    Last edited by Travelsonic; 01-26-11 at 02:22 AM.
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  2. #62
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    Alright, you want an argument?
    Yes, please!

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    How about the fact that cops have come out to say they would be investigated, fired, maybe arrested if they did what the TSA was doing with regards to the patdowns? How about that these federal agents can digitally strip search when real cops can't physically strip search us under most circumstances [not even in a courthouse]?
    Uh... still waiting on that argument...

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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    wow this is silly on so many levels LMAO



    Thieu plane their service their rules end of discussion dont like it dont fly
    What is silly is the fact you think this is some how different than the police randomly pulling cars over and strip searching people.




    Wrong again since there is consent from the passengers
    the airlines maybe able to complain that the government is doing something wrong against them but it wont be violation of the 4th LMAO
    A government agency strip searching you and doing invasive pat downs regardless if you walk,drive or fly is a violation of the 4th amendment. The government can not violate the 4th amendment






    true to bad you drive your own vehicle and it is not a service you are partaking in lol
    So if you take a train,cab, bus or a rental vehicle you should be subjected to strip searches and invasive pat downs by the government?




    irrelevant







    again irrelevant since there is consent
    Forcing you to submit to a strip search in order to use tax payer owned air space is just as much a violation of forcing you to submit to strip searches to use the road.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    And again, PROVE IT.

    Don't just say "it isn't" over and over
    Don't shift the goal posts, dodge the question

    Just try to prove your point and make an argument that is worth responding to.
    He's made his argument successfuly already:
    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    if the police stop me and want to search me I can say no and with out CONSENT or PROBABLY CAUSE they cant search me but if I do give them consent they can

    when you fly you give implied consent so your example is meaningless to the debate at hand.
    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    easy you are NOT partaking in a service in which you imply consent, like I said common sense
    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    anyway the airplane is just like any service.

    I can open a club tomorrow and have TSA policies for you to gain entrance, no search no entry/service.

    where your rights are, is the right to CHOOSE not to go to my club, just like you can CHOOSE not to fly

  5. #65
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    It blows my mind how common sense can escape some people when emotions run to deep and make them blind to reality.

    Listen
    you can HATE the TSA
    THINK the TSA goes to far
    THINK the policies arent effective
    FEEL uncomfortable about them
    PROTEST against them
    TRY and change them
    PETITION to change them
    VOTE to change them

    and thats fine and I agree with some of that but the TSA policies do NOT violate the constitution, there is no FORCE
    By that argument since you do not have a right to drive the police can pull over people and strip searching them and doing invasive pat downs as long as they say that by driving you give implied consent since you do not have to drive and therefore no force.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    What is silly is the fact you think this is some how different than the police randomly pulling cars over and strip searching people.
    thats because it absolutley IS 100% different LMAO common sense and reality make it that way sorry you are misinformed and cant see the obvious






    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    A government agency strip searching you and doing invasive pat downs regardless if you walk,drive or fly is a violation of the 4th amendment. The government can not violate the 4th amendment
    100% wrong when there is CONSENT and not force








    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    So if you take a train,cab, bus or a rental vehicle you should be subjected to strip searches and invasive pat downs by the government?
    "should be" who said that, that is a entirely DIFFERENT argument LMAO

    now COULD you be? if its a service you could be, yes and it would NOT violate the constitution because there is no force, STOP go back and read the bolded part again lol

    where your rights kick in is the choose not to train, cab, bus or rent




    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Forcing you to submit to a strip search in order to use tax payer owned air space is just as much a violation of forcing you to submit to strip searches to use the road.
    this is where you get in to trouble and obviously dont understand reality there is no FORCE with the TSA and that is a FACT, how dont you see that common sense
    LMAO
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    By that argument since you do not have a right to drive the police can pull over people and strip searching them and doing invasive pat downs as long as they say that by driving you give implied consent since you do not have to drive and therefore no force.
    actually NO what you are saying is NOT my argument by any wild stretch of the imagination LMAO are you just messing with me and making this stuff up as you go or do you actually belive this illogical stuff you are typing

    your example is NOTHING like what is being debated LMAO

    WOW
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    thats because it absolutley IS 100% different LMAO common sense and reality make it that way sorry you are misinformed and cant see the obvious

    How is a government agency strip searching you for air travel any different than the government strip searching for road travel? There is no difference. The government can not violate the 4th amendment just because you choose to travel by road or air.
    Last edited by jamesrage; 01-26-11 at 02:40 AM.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Travelsonic View Post
    Yeah, Centrist, because you say so there is no argument that is a violation... just after I specifically asked you to avoid this perpetuating stalemate inducing **** and put forth a real argument. Guy, I'm aiming that at you since you tried to shift the goalposts from my challenging you to you challenging me without attempting to counter with argument. >_<

    Alright, you want an argument? How about the fact that cops have come out to say they would be investigated, fired, maybe arrested if they did what the TSA was doing with regards to the patdowns? How about that these federal agents can digitally strip search when real cops can't physically strip search us under most circumstances [not even in a courthouse]?




    And again, PROVE IT.

    Don't just say "it isn't" over and over
    Don't shift the goal posts, dodge the question

    Just try to prove your point and make an argument that is worth responding to.
    LMAO are you this void of reality, there is no violation
    to violate the 4th you would need to be FORCED into search and seizure without probably cause, that does NOT happen, you consent to the search

    so there is you prove - VIOLA

    LMAO

    so again now that i proved it please tell me where the violation is and ill explain why you are wrong, it will be like shooting fish in a barrel, while were at it would you like proof of 2 + 2 = 4
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    Re: Ventura sues over body scans, pat-downs

    Quote Originally Posted by Centrist77 View Post
    actually NO what you are saying is NOT my argument by any wild stretch of the imagination LMAO are you just messing with me and making this stuff up as you go or do you actually belive this illogical stuff you are typing

    your example is NOTHING like what is being debated LMAO

    WOW
    What can be applied to airline travel can be applied to road travel,especially if you are going to use the BS line that you give implied consent and that you do not have to use that particular mode of transportation.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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